A woman has an obligation to give birth

Discussion in 'Abortion' started by kazenatsu, Jul 24, 2020.

  1. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    That’s what I’m asking. At what point before birth, if any, should the fetus be granted protection?
     
  2. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Now we are talking about euthanasia which is another discussion.
     
  3. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,768
    Likes Received:
    11,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No, I was just pointing out what you said was irrelevant.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,768
    Likes Received:
    11,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'm saying, it may not just be a single point.

    A fetus at 10 weeks might get more protection than a fetus at 5, and a fetus at 14 weeks might get more protection than a fetus at 10.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  5. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Actually I’m not arguing any position. I’m asking rhetorical questions. And with genetic testing a fetus with severe problems can be aborted early.
     
  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,768
    Likes Received:
    11,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The problem with that is sometimes fetuses with abnormalities are not spotted until late into the pregnancy.
    Sometimes very late.

    These tests are not always 100% accurate, like many people suppose.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  7. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok this is obviously a very emotional topic for you and much less so for me but I am curious where you think a woman should not be allowed to have an abortion.
     
  8. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok but my question to you still stands.
     
  9. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,768
    Likes Received:
    11,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Not really, I'm just having some intellectual fun arguing for a less popular position.

    You can't hurt my feelings here, not unless you bring stupidity into the discussion. (last part of that comment not aimed at you)
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  10. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I don’t pretend to know the correct answer but I can’t imagine a good reason for prohibiting abortion in the first trimester in particular. Seems like that’s plenty of time for a reasoned decision to be made.
     
  11. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,768
    Likes Received:
    11,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Here's the end of the first trimester:
    https://prolifelouisiana.org/learn/our-first-nine-months/12-weeks/
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  12. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    20,624
    Likes Received:
    7,596
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male

    Having an abortion IS dealing with it, you just don't like that method.
     
    Cosmo, Derideo_Te and FoxHastings like this.
  13. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
  14. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2010
    Messages:
    14,884
    Likes Received:
    4,862
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That could be argued but it hasn't been made formally, which is why the legal principle in the majority of countries in the world is that women don't have that as an unconditional obligation, even in those with strict limitations on the availability of abortion .

    In general terms, there are no absolutes in this topic, part of the reason it's such a difficult one to reach a conclusion on.

    That's a social and moral question though. What people should do and what they're permitted to do are rarely the same thing, not least because the former is open to wide variation in opinion and perception.
     
  15. btthegreat

    btthegreat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2010
    Messages:
    16,425
    Likes Received:
    7,083
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  16. cirdellin

    cirdellin Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2020
    Messages:
    2,612
    Likes Received:
    1,329
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    @btthegreat
    Ok, if the source you cite is correct. What constitutes a living creature’s right to exist? Are humans different?
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  17. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  18. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Messages:
    50,653
    Likes Received:
    41,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ringworm's have sentience as do many other parasites.

    Does that mean that you must just suffer with them?
     
    Cosmo and FoxHastings like this.
  19. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Messages:
    50,653
    Likes Received:
    41,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Does a fetus have even the slightest awareness of an abortion occurring?
     
    Cosmo and FoxHastings like this.
  20. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113

    NO, banning abortion would take away women's right of bodily autonomy making them slaves.



    You could argue something so silly but you have nothing to base that on....no one is obligated to have kids...nuns especially would object...as would any other intelligent people.



    "akin to" ? No it is a mother baby bond...:roll:

    Yup, and YOU aren't.


    So is belching.



    WHY do you have to avoid that ??? Too inconvenient to discuss ??



    In all senses, her body, her choice.




    What TF do you mean "not have to deal with the consequences"" ?
    Of course women deal with the consequences ...WTF ???






    THAT is an "argument" ?? LOL!
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  21. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113
    cirdellin said:
    Well in that case I imagine this conversation would not be happening for one thing.



    Could you explain HOW you could possibly draw that from the quote above????
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  22. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Some do, some don't but THEY are BORN people with rights..... a fetus isn't.
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  23. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113

    You REALLY aren't aware of abortion laws??? Even after al this time in the Abortion (And Anything Else ) Forum ??


    Abortion after 23 weeks is illegal......and why you seem to not know that is quite the mystery....
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  24. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113

    It's life IS protected after 23 weeks gestation....That is the stage of viability...
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  25. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2014
    Messages:
    56,891
    Likes Received:
    21,025
    Trophy Points:
    113


    Here we go again with a righty insisting ALL rapes are exactly alike and the women don't suffer any injuries or trauma from rape......



    Except it's nobody's business but theirs...
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.

Share This Page