Biden is creating a new White House office focused on gun violence prevention

They say a lock simply keeps an honest man honest.... If a thief wants something bad enough, they're going to find a way to get it.

 

And it is my contention that people have every right to own whatever they want secured within their homes or their vehicles and not having to worry about some scumbag coming to break in.

It is the scumbags who are to blame not the property owners.

 

Yes particularly young men. who don't have adequate mental health help available to them. just going to a therapist and having them mindlessly ask you "how does that make you feel" when a young man doesn't know how to put into words how that makes them feel. They are neglected and told it is their problem to sort out, be a man harden up. quit crying about it.

Most people who commit violent crime are men. most men who are violent criminals don't have a father in their life. I don't see this as a gun issue I see it as a systemic cultural issue. I remember hearing a prisoner who got a masters in behavioral sciences explain in a very simple way so the most lay of laymen could understand, Hurt people, hurt people. meaning people who are hurting are the ones that hurt others. And his words resonated with me so much more than some lofty academic in some ivory tower somewhere. mostly because I saw dumb forgotten lost men who dropped out of high school understand.

If you want to stop violence or reduce it you have to get to the core of it. I think there is generally 3 reasons people are violent. 1 idiopathic. meaning unknown some people for whatever reason just delight in causing pain. essentially just evil. I think this is the most rare. 2 Frustration and anger breeding apathy these are your school shooters, people who like starting crap think the knock out game. less rare than 1 but more rare than 3. 3 justification. this shares anger and frustration but doesn't normally involve apathy. it normally manifests as thuggery self centeredness sometimes referred to as anti social or sociopathic. Essentially they know there are rules and consequences for not following them but they need money. a lot of people see this as serial killer because there is a lot of entertainment created around that which I find creepy. but no serial killers typically fit into the first category. and there is a very rare circumstance that shouldn't be overlooked but is hard to quantify. rage delirium for lack of a better term. normally they are justified. think an abused wife that have been beaten and cussed out for fifteen years by her husband and just shoves a knife in his eye when she can't take it anymore. this is uncommon.

So, thinking about all of this stuff and I didn't even scratch the surface is so much more complicated than just calling out gun control. which one do you think makes a better political slogan? Which one a better bumper sticker? Can problems be solved with a political slogan or a bumper sticker?

My solution is inelegant filled with pitfalls and rife for mistakes it is a difficult thing to understand and solve it isn't easy and we are going to have to ask ourselves some really tough questions and put in hours months years decades into it. it isn't an easy slap dash solution like write more words on paper. but I think with the desire and perseverance it will be a more effective one.

 

Well a few years ago I was shopping for a vehicle gun safe and any of them in my price range would have just let anyone who looked in the window know there was a firearm inside. It is essentially a billboard saying there is a gun inside. and a crowbar would defeat most in this range. I thought my solution was rather elegant. because this gun had a polymer lower. I could take the slide barrel and magazine out and leave it in the car and carry the polymer lower with me. The only issue with this is they don't allow you to even have a component with you in some places. I understand the worry. one person can bring a lower and another can bring the upper and assemble a gun in a courtroom or something. this is easily solved by saying lowers only.

There are ways to use common sense it just doesn't jive with a lot of people.

 

But you don't explain what that is. leaving it in your car out of sight locked with the windows rolled up is reasonable. I don't think people are intentionally leaving them on the dashboard. Is what I suggested not reasonable? Do you think it is? Let's set some terms here.

 

Of course.

 

So give me an idea of what is responsible. I mentioned two things one in post 254 and one in post 255 what do you think about those? reasonable? not reasonable?

 

OK.... just some thoughts on that. Storage in secure place. * under lock and key ) Particularly if there are children in the home.

Would not leave a weapon in a vehicle. Of what value is it there if the rational is for it to serve as self defense??

Cleaning..........Never clean a weapon ( or even handle it around children of any age. Or pets for that matter .
If a gun is stolen.......report it immediately.

These are just basic things. (that everyone should know and practice)
I recall situation where a chap was cleaning his gun, while his toddler sat beside him on the couch. The gun went off , killing the infant. THAT is stupidity.

 

When there are children in the home i take them apart. a kid can use a lock and open a box assembling a gun is a bit more difficult

I drive to work, I drive through very bad naighborhoods sometimes at two in the morning. Homeland security and a dozen other reasons say I cant take the gun into the petrochemical plant I work in. So i ether have to throw away my career and the money i make with it or risk getting carjacked because some scumbag thinks my car is theirs to break into? Why do I have to be punished for the thieves behavior? Why do i lose my rights possibly even my life because I have to be responsible for the thieves?

I don't think there is the slightest reason for this.

If I am going to be treated like a criminal no. I should be seen as a victim not interrogated about why i had it in my car. With this crap you are talking about there is no way in hell I would report it. I might wind up in jail

Yes and no. being safe around kids is important. but i think if you take your son or daughter shooting they should know how to clean the gun. There where things you said that were not just not basic but unacceptable. I should be allowed to keep property in my car.

No guns don't go off. they aren't lit sticks of dynamite. What happened was he was being careless. before you clean your gun you are supposed to take the ammo out. This is basic. people say guns just go off because they want to believe they are this dangerous lit stick of dynamite. but the reality is they are very safe if you have the right attitude.

This also seems to be a manipulative move because it seems like people that sight these incidents like to believe and suggest they can happen to anyone. no, they happen to idiots. I tell myself that I am not crazy even if I check my gun six times before I start cleaning it. this chap didn't check once. that wasn't the gun going off that was negligence. I bet he faced a negligence charge.

 

OK, thx. This has been an excellent conversation.

I can totally understand why you need to have a gun with you en route to the job. Sounds like you have thought of everything and are a responsible gun owner. The important thing is that it works for you. That is what matters.

 

More conspiracies

 

I am glad we could find some common ground.

 

So if this conspiracy isn't true and these people are far too incompetent to know they will get bitch slapped by the court how is that better.

So your position is they are too stupid to be corrupt?

 

On point 3: I would say the opposite. Harsher punishments on kids carrying out petty crime. Too many are just let off with no punishment at all. How many times I've heard kids saying "you can't touch me" as they casually carry out shop lifting in view of everyone. In my city steaming by classes of kids is now a daily occurrence at the end of a school day. Stop them early before they go on to do higher levels of crime after leaving school which they will do as they find out that crime is a well paid job. The punishment can just be a few hours in a boring cell in isolation which would be enough to deter most casual thieves from repeating their hobby.

 

I don't think we are disagreeing on #3

 

that's probably where we would have some issues of disagreement but certainly some psychological problems should be addressed before someone can possess firearms. However, I have seen some advocate bans on anyone who is seeking mental health therapy and I would oppose that

 

Taking criminals off the street and placing them in confinement prevents those criminals from committing crimes.

Releasing them, so they can re-offend, or not detaining them at all has proven to be a monumental failure

 

If a person is assessed to be a danger to himself and/or others, the care plan would involve safety measures regarding weapons.. If there is a history of same, then the same principle applies. If a person is clinically delusional and / or paranoid........same thing. The potential for acting out their delusions is fairly high if not treated and then followed up.
Most mass shooters had or have psych problems. Or are delusional about some component of people in society. On the surface they seem to be very prejudiced, but it is a lot deeper than that.

BTW: disagreements make for a lively discussion

 

What happened to the 500,000 charging stations?

 

Maybe Joe put Kamala in charge.

 

So if an intruder breaks into the house during the night you want me to ask him to wait while I go downstairs and open the gun safe. You want to keep the guns from children. So do I. There aren't any children here. Next idea?

 

Same situation, but I keep a biometric safe in the bedroom. I want to be somewhat wide awake if opting to use a gun. First line of defense are dogs and an ADT alarm. But generally speaking these liberals can [expletive].

 

But he asked what does registration do for gun owners, not for government. You answered a question that was not asked.

 

Mate if your ONLY means of defence is a gun then you might as well hand the gravedigger his shovel and go lie in the hole. Where do you currently keep the gun that you can instantly access it 24/7??

 

You sound smart - DONT rely one one thing athat can and will go wrong but have multi backups. Plus the likelihood is low to nonexistent that some kid visiting your place is going to access that gun