Benghazi attacks were preventable, says Senate committee report

Well, you give too much credit to our politicians. There are other actors, that you haven't met because we are at war, and they are kept from you. But I've met and spoke with those possessing the ideology we are at war with. And the 2004 election, or anything else our politicians are doing doesn't explain their ideology, and the conflict that is just developing.

 

Maybe someday we will be at war, but we aren't now, and we really haven't been since Vietnam, in a real sense.
There was never a path to victory in Afghanistan or Iraq, it was just mess em up until the public gets sick of it , and pulling out gets more votes than fighting.

 

No, the path to victory was always there, secure, train the moderates so they wouldn't be steamrolled by the radicals when we left. It was a doable mission, and still is. But I don't think you can be in Afghan or Iraq in the last decade, and characterize it as anything but a war.

 

Oh, it's a war over there for sure, but the US isn't at war, hasn't been for decades.
What have you had to give up for the war effort?
Heck, your taxes have gone down, we can do that by cutting veterans benefits in the future, so it all works out.
That isn't a war, it's a campaign stunt...

 

Talk to me when gas is $10 a gallon, and no one can move. Then you will see what the war effort was for.

 

Oh it was partly for oil, and the political influence handing out the contracts would bring, but we just don't have the military capable of pulling that off, not without a real war, so we settled for a backdrop for a "War President" campaign.
Gas is going to be $10/gallon, no matter what we do, that's what happens to a limited commodity....

 

There's no need to suppose; it's a historical and legal fact that diplomacy predates and is not exclusive to nation-states. There's no rule saying "thou shalt not negotiate with parties other than nation-states". You made an incorrect assumption, get over it.

 

I think the State Department, probably led by people with your mindset, made the incorrect assumption, and it got people killed. Why don't you tell me about the diplomacy going on right now in Libya? Oh, media blackout so no one knows.

 

Oblah-blah just wanted to give his Muslime brothers some payback.

 

That smacks of a personal attack, but OK, I'll bite.

- What, in your opinion, is my "mindset", and how is it relevant to this discussion? Please name these people by name.

- What precisely was the "incorrect assumption" that you're alleging was made? Please be specific and detailed.

- Precisely what is the cause and effect that "got people killed"? What is the name(s) of the person or persons in the State Department who knowingly sent those people to certain death?

You're claiming that people did something wrong. If that's the case, it's your responsibility to speak up and bring justice for the killed. OTOH if you're just making up a story for the purpose of partisan sniping, then it's you who is doing something wrong. It's a serious offense to claim that a crime was committed when there was none. There's no middle ground here; someone is being seriously bad. It's up to you to show who's right and who's in the wrong.

Because that's not the topic being discussed here. Why are you trying to change the subject?

 

I find it interesting, that the "conservative" pseudo Republican contingent feel these four(4) deaths of Americans are more important than several thousand deaths from similarly ignorant and deficient....if not deceitful actions from the previous administration.

It would seem based on a purely partisan mindset.

 

It's not a personal attack for me to say that your assumptions seem to be dangerous ones for our diplomats of Africa and the Middle East. I thought you made it clear that you didn't see the necessity of having 2 functioning governments in order to conduct diplomacy. AQ and affiliates or others with like minded goals are destabilizing govts across the region. The level of control that extremists have in these governments, and in local govts as well, should be thought about a little more before we go in all willy nilly, based on some theoretical idea on paper that you seem to be raising that says 2 functioning governments aren't needed for diplomacy. Maybe so, but you better be cautious and prepared. I don't need specific names to recognize a culture that downplays terrorism as a threat. My agenda is to win. That culture, or mindset, does not help me win. It's nothing personal.

 

Never let it be said that I didn't give you a fair chance.

The fact is that you are using the argumentum ad hominem; you are blaming me and nobody else that you can think of, for things that you can't even think of. As an argument it's a loser. It's not even an argument as much as it's just lashing out blindly.

If you're talking about the federal, state and local governments in/of the United States of America, I do agree. The sort of extremist "anger without any plan" that yourself and other GOP operatives are promoting is IMO Public Enemy #1 to the United States of America!

This nation became great because disparate people found common causes and worked together to build the nation. The teqabagger mantra that "we're mad as hell and aren't going to take it anymore!" is not unifying, serves no useful purpose, and has proved to be the single most destructive ideology that the US has ever seen.

So in other words you're a Social Darwinist. Your use of the singular possessive ("my") indicates that you're not serving your country or your fellow human beings, only yourself. How ignoble! It's also the same old GOP rhetoric (just like "greed is good" in the '80s) that has been chipping away at our once-great union for over 50 years. This brand of disorganized selfishness that has led to the demise of all great empires.

Every time that someone disrespects the office of the President of the United States of America for no good reason, they're waging war against the nation and people of the United States of America. That's the bottom line here.

 

The POTUS had me fighting wars. The POTUS has my friends still fighting wars. The Islamic extremist ideology of those we have been fighting all these years struck us yet again in Benghazi. And my POTUS didn't out them for what they were, he instead blamed it on a mob and a video, that was implicitly America's fault. I'm not supposed to say, "Hey wait a minute!"? The only way to win this is to out these people for who they are, and what they want. That wasn't done in Benghazi.

 

I find your opinion a bit simplistic....if not ignorant of the complexity of this entire issue and the actions involved in it. Without a doubt hindsight allows us all to recognize the errors of foreign policy and diplomatic action (see war in Iraq.) Had we had the foresight required to "Know" this was about to happen...we may have been able to commit the resources needed to deal with it, we did not.

Given that the nearest available air support was five hours away once committed, and that the only support was a CIA compound that did not have the ability to respond appropriately, combined with the fact this was not an embassy and thus unprotected by law and force.....is this in any way unique?

 

For one, Benghazi was unique in its effect on our enemy. We are fighting a war to bend the enemy's will to ours. And they are trying to bend ours to theirs. Islamic extremist groups want a Middle East in which no Westerners are on their soil. Although the extremists are a minority in any given population, they are willing to use spectacular acts of violence to accomplish their political objectives. Any successes only increase their will, and embolden them. They are basically bandits, who want to dictate trade and diplomacy through despicable acts of violence. The only way to beat them, is to destroy their will. In order to destroy their will, they must be shown that resistance is futile. The enemy must be shown that continuing the conflict will cost more than what it can accomplish. It is the same strategy they are using on the West. Benghazi was a success that emboldened the enemy in a way they haven't experienced since 9/11/01. They were led further down the path that their tactics have a chance at succeeding, NOT down the path we want, in which they view their tactics as not likely to succeed.

 

This is why we were even there in the first place. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wha9lTKN7Zg
Obama's war for oil.

 

As Ronald Reagan famously said, "there you go again". You're repeating the same debunked lie, and it's not getting any more traction this time than before. You're done; you lost.

As any high school graduate knows, only Congress has the power to declare war. Another fail.

I don't believe for a minute that you actually served in the US military. But if you had, you should hide in shame for disrespecting your Commander-in-Chief, your flag and your country. It's your privilege to live in ignorance of the facts. But to spread harmful propaganda during wartime is just plain dishonorable. Shame on you!

 

First, I am not losing. Even if they get away with no accountability for their actions or inaction in Benghazi, they realize they aren't going to do it so easily. Some of us are paying attention. Second, I held my tongue for the 10 years I was in, now I'm out, I have freedom of speech that the military protects (btw, a freedom that was questioned both in my college classroom, and at the UN, because our leaders blamed it on a YouTube video). Third, as any American knows, if the POTUS wants to withdraw our troops from our wars, he can, and instantly, which he proved in Iraq. Fourth, I don't need you to believe I was in the military, I don't use it to make my points, I only use it to show people where I'm coming from with my opinions. Fifth, it was AQ and their friends who disrespected our flag and country by murdering our ambassador, dragging him through the streets, probably sodomizing him (although reports of that only persisted for the first couple of days, and then disappeared), and raising their flag over our consulate, and killing 2 of our Seal team, the same tip of the sword who killed their beloved leader. The only fail here is a nation of people who let our political leaders send our people out to wars as pawns, while they ask no questions about wtf we are actually doing.