Pentagon Has ‘Off-World Vehicles Not Made on This Earth’

Knapp believes Lazar. But I hold on to the possibility Lazar is a helluva liar. Truth is, I just don't know.

That Lazar knew where those craft at s4 would be flown and the time and day is some evidence Lazar's story could be in part true.

Lear OTOH, believes what he talks about. But too sci fi for me. I don't believe much of what he says. Otherwise he is sane when it comes to piloting various aircraft and has credentials.

There are some real characters in ufology.

 

Yes both and listened to some interviews.

Hopkins writes of hypnotic induced experiences that are benign or positive in nature while the opposite is seen in Jacobs. I find that interesting.

Yet I have seen no evidence of abductions. And I understand we really don't understand consciousness. I need more than just tales.

 

Well, first of all the closest star to our sun is so far away that light would take 4 years to get here. Space is far more empty than people understand it to be. Our best speed technology would require more than a 100 years to get there and send us a message of what was found.

Beyond that, science is NOT saying that there is no life anywhere else in the universe. The conversation you had was not science at all. The question of life somewhere else in the universe doesn't include any evidence in support of either possible answer. Scientists speculate about this - but that doesn't mean it's more than speculation.

Yes - everything in that paragraph is definitely NOT science.

"War of the Worlds" was written in 1953 and was imensly popular. In fact, there was a radio show at that time that was a HUGE deal, because it got a serious percent of the US population in a panic.

Suggeting that thoughts of space aliens is as recent as you claim is just not the case.

Close. Scientists will say that there isn't enough evidence to support the hypothesis that aliens have visited Earth.

As you point out there are people who come up with "compelling" stories all the time. That is not going to be considered evidence.

Having ME look is not what is important. The reason is that I'm not an expert, I don't have equipment for analyzing materials, I'm denied access to the materials, etc., etc., etc.

Suggesting "I won't look" is ridiculous.

If "evidence" is released, I will want to know what a major cross section of experts say after examining that "evidence".

And, that's how you should look at it, too.

The search for life in this universe is ABSOLUTELY NOT limited to listening for radio signals. The problem with radio signals is that they attenuate over long distances. If there are aliens and if they are looking for other life forms, it is highly unlikely that they would find Earth by listening to radio signals. Everything we transmit is just far too weak.

The idea that you know so much about aliens that you know how they communicate is just plain silly.

The problem with telepathy isn't that someone might claim that it is metaphysical - it's that it doesn't work.

 

Wait for Trump's tweet, then we can be sure.

 

The telepathic communication is a problems. What life on earth including man communicates by telepathy? It is an old idea talked about in some circles in the late 19th century. Mind reading, seances, channeling, telepathy.

We are not telepathic even if they are! Lol We communicate in words.

Guess there is always the tried and true sign language!

 

Much of that is true IMO.

Yet it is also true that the Brookings Institute looked to see how it would effect us if told ETs exist. And fly at will in our airspace unimpeded. And perhaps even take humans?

Govt might keep that secret. Even ridicule society, along with msm. For our best interests. Our big daddy.

 

I look at things that are compelling to me. That's it. I find it odd that someone wouldn't find it compelling that people form all walks of life who don't know each other tell the very same story. If it were pure imagination, the stories wouldn't be the same.

Explain that one to me.

Who said I know so much about aliens? You are embracing scientific standards, yet your standard applied to me is very sloppy. This indicates to me that you understanding of science is probably just as sloppy, as well.

There is no 'problem' with telepathy. Every testimony of people claim to be abducted by aliens tell us that that is the method they use to communicate.

No one varies that story, now why is that? yes, not proof of anything, but, to my way of thinking, it's compelling.

Sometimes intuition is a good thing, and here is one quantum physics scientist who tells us that it's not a bad thing at all, in science.

 

His lectures don't come close to the detail in his book, 'Walking Among Us'. Give it a shot.

 

He wrote a lengthy report on why the maj 12 docs were authentic.
http://www.stantonfriedman.com/index.php?ptp=articles&fdt=2004.04.15
There is my 1990 108-page “Final Report On Operation Majestic 12” (Ref. 2) and my 272-page 1996 book “TOP SECRET/MAJIC” (Ref. 3). There are several lengthy papers (Ref. 4- and Kevin Randle’s new book “Case MJ-12” (Ref. 9).


This is an excerpt from the Eisenhower Briefing Document, presented by Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoeter for a commission dedicated to the task which consists of high ranking military, political, and scientific personnel, ( as named in the document, on November 18, 1952) and the document is about the Roswell incident which occurred years earlier. During these years, they've had plenty of time to assess what it was they were looking at, noting that men of his caliber do NOT make wild assumptions let alone commit them to print in briefing documents to presidents.

http://www.majesticdocuments.com/pdf/eisenhower_briefing.pdf
On 07 July, 1947, a secret operation was begun to assure
recovery of the wreckage of this object for scientific study.
During the course of this operation, aerial reconnaissance
discovered that four small human-like beings had apparently
ejected from the craft at some point before it exploded.
These had fallen to earth about two miles east of the wreckage
site. All four were dead and badly decomposed due to action
by predators and exposure to the elements during the
approximately one week time period which had elapsed before their
discovery. A special scientific team took charge of removing
these bodies for study. (See Attachment "C".) The wreckage
of the craft was also removed to several different locations.
(See Attachment "B".) Civilian and military witnesses in
the area were debriefed, and news reporters were given the
effective cover story that the object had been a misguided
weather research balloon.

A covert analytical effort organized by Gen. Twining and
Dr. Bush acting on the direct orders of the President,
resulted in a preliminary consensus (19 September, 1947) that
the disc was most likely a short range reconnaissance craft.
This conclusion was based on for most part on the craft's
size and the apparent lack of any identifiable provisioning.
(See Attachment "D".) A similar analysis of the four dead
occupants was arranged by Dr. Bronk. It was the tentative
conclusion of this group (30 November, 1947) that although
these creatures are human-like in appearance, the biological
and evolutionary processes responsible for their development
has apparently been quite different from those observed or
postulated in homo-sapiens. Dr. Bronk's team has suggested
the term "Extra-terrestrial Biological Entities", or "EBEs"
be adopted as the standard term of reference for these
creature until such time as a more definitive designation
can be agreed upon. Since it is virtually certain that these craft do not origin-
ate in any country on earth...

There are a number of debunkers regarding the documents, but Friedman's 108 page report addresses the issues the debunkers raise.

 

I was VERY clear. If you think something wasn't clear, then say what it was rather than accusing me of being "sloppy".

The fact that stories about aliens have numerous similarities is not even slightly strange. They build off of each other. They come from SciFi. They come from hoaxers. Etc., etc.

Intuition is fine. But, what it (and ALL of theoretical physics, for that matter) is used for is important. It is used for pointing the way for scientific exploration - for testing.

It is NOT used as a statement of truth. Intuition and truth are not the same thing.

 

The problem with telepathy is that there is no evidence of it.

There are lots of claims by people who have stories to tell.

But, there is no scienific evidence that it is real.

 

It doesn't exist with humans, this is understood.

Science hasn't examined aliens (at least not publicly) given they are clandestine bunch, nor has science examined the abductee phenomenon.

That isn't the same thing as 'no evidence'. There is no evidence of light if you don't open your eyes, but that doesn't mean light doesn't exist.

For hundreds of years, science claimed there was no evidence of giant squids, until one day the carcass of one drifted ashore. Thousands of sailors have claimed they saw them over hundreds of years. Thousands have seen Sasquatch, yet Science claims they do not exist.

See? Science is usually hundreds of years behind human witness.

Are you going to state that Christ did not exist because there is 'no evidence' of him walking the earth?

Such is the case with aliens, and telepathy.

 

See #87

People will have faith in the existence of some things because they have experienced them, or have known others whom they trust who experienced them.

Science tends to be a few hundred years behind human witness.

That is why I'm not going to wait around until science catches wind of something that thousands, if not millions, witness. No, I'm not saying it's 'science', I'm saying I don't give a damn.

 

People will have faith in the existence of some things because they have experienced them, or have known others whom they trust who experienced them.

Science tends to be a few hundred years behind human witness. Such was the case for the giant squid, such is the case for Bigfoot and aliens.

That is why I'm not going to wait around until science catches wind of something that thousands, if not millions, witness. After 20 years of project BlueBook, J. Allen Hynek finally admitted he was no longer a skeptic. It took him 20 years, and the reason is that he is a scientist. Of course, as a scientist you have to do that or lose your reputation.
That's the nature of science, it's the last in line for knowledge acquisition because it cannot afford the luxury of faith. I understand that and you have made your point. But, as a layman, I can afford to base my opinion on public testimony if there is enough of it ( accompanied by compelling circumstance).
So, no, I'm not saying it's 'science', I'm saying I don't give a damn. I don't base my opinion in a vacuum, I do at least need tons of reportage and compelling circumstance.

Humans have been abducted in groups, and each member of the group testified to this. Abductees have reported they were returned outside of their home ( when they were taken from within their house ) and found themselves locked outside their home. People have testified they were abducted, and when they returned, they found themselves with someone else clothes on. People have been abducted while family members could not find them until they were returned by the aliens ( corroborating that they were missing ). No, it isn't proof, but, for laymen, given the thousands of testimony, it's enough for a laymen like myself to have faith in it's veracity. There are tons of other types of 'evidence', such as trace evidence left by spacecraft, materials found on lawns and grounds which science cannot determine the nature of, noting that nothing would grow where it was claimed the spacecraft landed. Animals have been mutilated going back to the 50s, and in ALL cases, blood is completely drained, there are no hoof prints, foot prints, of animals of people of the mutilated animal, and not one person (or animal) has ever been witnessed doing the act, so far, 10,000 mutilations have been reported. Moreover, scavenger animals avoid the dead carcass, they won't come near it. In some cases, internal organs were removed ( such as the heart) and there were NO exit wounds ( explain that one to me ). The FBI has investigated and cannot determine who the perps are. Not even the hoof prints of the mutilated animal, it was as if it was dropped to the ground from above, ( noting that many times there are broken bones). One animal was mutilated and the carcass was found sitting on top of a fence. ( there is a photo of it). I'm not a scientist, I don't have a professional reputation to maintain. But there is a ton of **** that points to aliens.

There's an old saying, if it walks like a duck, it talks like a duck, it's probably a duck.

This story walks a helluva like a duck.

I"m calling it a duck.

Science can drag it's ass all it wants, I'm not a scientist.

 

Delete

 

Yeah, agree on the alien abduction stories. They build on one another and even add things over time.

Bassett uses the numerous accounts as evidence. He says there are so many of them that this is proof! Lol

Would we even have them if not for the Hill family? And hypnosis?

Likewise the account of that pilot that used the word, saucers, while their shape was not saucer shaped but shoe heel shaped suddenly turned into saucers! The power of suggestion? I find it weird.

 

Light is one small part of a huge spectrum of electromagnetic radiation. Almost NONE of that spectrum can be detected by the human eye. Our knowledge of this radiation has very little to do with direct observation. It has to do with evidence that meets requirements of science.

Science did not say there were no giant squids. It said there was no scientific evidence of such squids. And, that was certainly true. Science has requirements for evidence. Tales from the sea can not be considered proof. In fact, "fish tales" are so hilariously out of proportion that it is an expression of disbelief - decidedly NO just by science.

The existence of squids certainly has NO bearing on whether the Northwest where I live has Sasquatches trodding our forests. The vast percentage of "footprints", etc. have been proven to be fakes. Few are interested in working to prove the rest as fakes.

Science is thousands of years behind the full truth on Earth. That isn't an important statement AT ALL. The question is how does mankind go about learning the truth about how things work in this universe - what are the methods that have the greatest success?

The answer to that is scientific method. There isn't even another contender.

Doubling down about aliens by claiming you know how they communcate (using a method that is totally indetectable, no less) is such pure speculation that I don't know why anyone would bother addressing it.

 

We are not talking about the secrets of the universe, we are talking about aliens. Aliens are just people, who live somewhere else, they are sentient beings.

Aliens are visiting earth, MILLIONS have seen them, thousands of books have been written, they are on cave drawing walls, they are in scripture, they are in paintings of antiquity, they are ****ing everywhere, hundreds of thousands have been abducted by them, giving the same ****ing story, all of them, that aliens communicate via telepathy, that all aliens collect sperm and ova, every frickin one of them. There are hundreds, thousands of UP FRONT AND CLOSE sightings of ships 'floating' in the air, the size of a football field. Google the 'belgium wave'. This isn't 'fish tales'. That's good enough for me to have an opinion.

I don't give **** what some dumbass scientist says. I listen to people. Watch 'sirius disclosure' testimoney from air force personnel, pilots, military, etc. Testimony from police. After 20 years and thousands of investigations, J. Allen Hynek changed his stance from that of a skeptic to that of a someone who accepted that it is possible they are visiting earth. That's quite a thing for a scientist to say that.

 

Do you care about what some dumbass scientist says or not??

It still remains that there is no physical evidence. There are MANY reasons that people report these events - big foot, UFOs, the Loch Ness monster, etc.

These claims are fantastic enough to require significant evidence. So far, no such evidence is available.

 

The Belgium Wave was outed as a total hoax.

That included the one photograph they concocted.

How much longer are UFOlogists going to point at the Belgium Wave and cry "evidence"??

The thing is, even when these claims are PROVEN to be crap, they never die. There will always be someone like you who comes along to claim the Belgium Wave is real.

Please remember that the UFOlogists LIED TO YOU about the Belgium Wave.

 

millions have witnessed UFOs, from far away to close up. They've left trace evidence for which labs cannot tell what the stuff is
So, what you are saying, out of those millions, not one is true.

If only one is true, that's all we need to know. That, out of millions, to say ALL are false, I find that hard to believe.

I think the likelihood that aliens do not want us to have evidence, is what is going on. They are operating clandestinely. The times we witness them are incidental to their actual presence.

There is a thing called presumptive evidence in the face of overwhelming circumstantial evidence, such that, a reasonable person can hold the opinion
that they are likely to be true. That is where I'm at, and I really don't care about what a Scientist requires, I have no such reputation to uphold.

But if you want to lop me in with bunch of loons, then all those military high tech personnel in the Sirius CD, including airline pilots, are loons, too.

 

No doubt there are plenty of hoaxes.

But why would the air force also hoax people like LMH? The Kirkland air base event and Richard Doty?

She was given documents to read but not copy that were bizarre in regards to ETs. Back when she was a legit award winning journalist .

Don't you find that strange? Why did the air force do that? For shits and giggles?

 

I absolutely do not want to "loop you in with a bunch of loons".

However, you HAVE attempted to support your opinion using claims from UFOlogists who absolutely DID set out to LIE to you.

You claim you have no such reputation to uphold, so you can disregard science.

HOWEVER, you made claims based on LIES!! Does THAT not reflect on your reputation?

And, by failing to be curious enough to consider what science might have found, you did not protect yourself against propagating that lie in this thread.

I would claim that DOES reflect on your reputation.

In the end, I'd like to encourage you to be a little more skeptical - willing to look at the evidence against, for example.

There was a photograph from the Belgium wave. A skeptical reaction would be to see what experts thought of that photo after having examined it.

 

I don't believe the pilots reporting these things are hoaxers. And speculating about the air force (did you mean navy?) makes no more sense than speculating about aliens. There are LOTS of things the air force is dedicated to obfuscating. Allowing people to think that there are aliens flying all over the place might even play a role in that important obfuscation. But, is that whats happening? That information is not available to us.

There absolutely ARE hoaxers. These hoaxes get pulled appart all the time. And, there are events that have not been fully explained.

The question is where to go from there.

In my view, the full evidence has to become available for critical analysis by a wide variety of totally unrelated experts. That is a principle of scientific method - not something new and created just for this issue.

So far, that has certainly not happened with the navy and air force material.

 

They have been here for a long time. They seem to be watchers.

That is one conjecture.

All I know is a non human craft exists. And it flies in our airspace unimpeded.

With unimaginable powers.