Russia Declares War on Ukraine<<MOD WARNING>>

Russian stock market collapsed 45% already, and thats only the beginning, and they WILL lose lot of troops, so regular Russian people won't be happy about this for long.

 

I would say the reason we are not directly confronting Russia is because this could very easily go nuclear. Maybe not with strategic nuclear weapons, but certainly with tactical nuclear weapons. We would likely lose soldiers by the thousands. It may still come to that, but it is something we need to approach carefully. I think right now we are doing the best we can without escalating the conflict into a global one.

 

Even if it did not get nuclear, the losses would so high that US will not, and should not consider taking on Russia unless a NATO county is attacked.

 

Sad but true

 

Bingo. Spot-on.

 

Should have clarified better - was talking about blunders prior to the Crisis .. as in decades prior. The moves on the geopolitical chessboard that these nations have been making .. so has nothing to do with Biden. Annexing Kosovo for example .. but there are many others .. generalized "Do as we say - Not as we do" foreign policy.

 

The only possible thing would have been to show strength rather than weakness. May not have been enough, though.

 

So far, it looks like Ukrainian armed forces are holding the ground.
I’m very hopeful about their abilities.

 

There are 2 possible scenarios for what is happening now with the Russian invasion of Ukraine...

a) The Russians only want to occupy eastern Ukraine
b) The Russians want once and for all in Ukraine ... let me say ... clean up and they occupy the whole Ukraine.

Both are easily capable of Russian forces, but at the moment no one can say which of the two scenarios is correct. That Russia attacks also outside eastern Ukraine is ... sorry to say ... normal military acting and means nothing. Of course and for example does Russia attack Ukrainian Air Bases to prevent that they make air attacks on the Russian ground forces.
Putin will not make any further attacks on the NATO members, because that will undoubtedly mean World War III with minimum complete NATO against Russia, Belarus and whoever else thinks to be ally of Russia then.

But I would like to say something about Putin again, because, as always and as usual, there is a lot of bullshit being spread here in the forum and in the media.
Putin is not crazy and he is not running amok either! No, he's coldly calculating and he's ... unfortunately well-reasoned ... pissed off at the West. The fact is that for at least minum 20 years the West has treated Russia without any respect and doesn't give a damn about Russia's interests and will. To give one of many examples:
In 2007 the then US President Bush Junior had installed an anti-missile screen in Eastern Europe ... allegedly against the evil Iranian missiles threatening Europe. Anyone with more than a vaccum in their head knew that it was a lie and that it was aimed at Russia.
The question arises, why and what had Russia previously done "evil" that the USA install the Anti Missile Screen? The answer is TOTALLY NOTHING! Any windering that Putin was well-reasoned annoyed about it?

It's also ridiculous when the Western media, as well as members of the forum, talk about that the uprising of the Russian population in Donbass is illegal, etc. Sorry ... THE WEST, with its unbelievable hypocrisy, had made in Kosovo again?
Alleged or actual massacres by the Serbs on the poor Albanians in Kosovo ... whereby the Albanian insurgents demonstrably also committed massacres ... and the West has nothing better to do than separate Kosovo from Serbia with a war without a UN mandate.
Funny... somehow we have exactly the same situation here in eastern Ukraine, only this time no insurgents supported by the west... and already they don't have the same rights as the Albanians in Kosova did have back then!

Finally ... the constant russian claim that they would have cheated russia with the eastward expansion of NATO is just a lie!
It was Russian President Yeltsin who allowed these countries to become members of NATO back in the late 1990's. And if the Russian President of once said it's OK, then the Russian President of today can't claim such a bullshit of lies now!

 

Now that the commies are rolling in, the Ukrainians need to find their own "The Spirit of the Winter War" and use it to unite and take down the invaders.

The Spirit of the Winter War is the national unity that had been credited with having saved Finland from disintegrating along class and ideological lines under the invasion of the Soviet Union during the Winter War from November 30, 1939 to March 13, 1940. - Wiki

 

Only something that the majority of US people won't accept ... to make alone an alliance with Ukraine with the high risk to get in direct war with Russia then ... and @ US people here: How many of you would have accept such a war with Russian for Ukraine with for sure many US losses and a risk that it becomes nuclear in the end?

Even this dumbass clown Trump made statement that with him in White House, Russia would not have attacked now is only a bad comedy show and usual "alternative truth bullshit bla bla bla" of him. Truth is that Russia would not have a need to attack, because Trump would have given permission for Russia to enter eastern Ukraine ... a gift for his old and beloved buddy Putin.

A further attack of Russia on a NATO member like Poland, the Baltics or Romania is something else ... totally different an will mean 3rd world war!

 

They're badly positioned geographically compared to Finland. They're surrounded on 3 sides by russian troops while the Fins had only the southern front where the russian really tried to invade in force. There was a northern front but the russian didn't really put any effort in.

 

And ... did Finland win this "winter war" once after heroic fighting? No!

 

True about three sides in Ukraine, but USSR did attack from multiple areas along the 1000 Finnish border. Ukraine could concentrate on destroying one of the three assaults first, and then move on to next. One tactic is to allow them to advance, and then cut them off from from behind and destroy them.



Winter War

 

The ukrainian army is to small to cover 3 fronts. And in the case of Finland, The northern attack by russian weren't really supported as Russia was aiming for the lake Ladoga portion of Finland. Their goal was to control the Gulf of Finland for their fleet. Without this, they were pretty much stuck in port for the duration which is what happened in the end.

 

The Soviet goal was to take Finland in 2 weeks and make it part of USSR, but instead they took massive casualties and gave up on their goals. They took small chunks of Finland, but Finns consider it a victory since they repealed the attack and remained a free country

 

Hmmm... Are you an American? Because of your ideas you cannot be other nation
Ukrainian government already lost control. Russian army very quickly occupied all territory. Ukrainian army runs. Sometimes they run directly in Russia

 

you don't know Ukrainians well...it's not Arabs at all.

Russia already received 101 packages of sanctions two days ago. I don't think that these threats scare anyone.

Of course yes. If Putin takes over Ukraine, he will have to pay Ukrainian debts and loans. No, Ukraine will remain independent... at least some part of it.

High-precision cruise missiles bombed all the warehouses with the vaunted American Javelins. Sadness. Is this a force majeure, or will Ukraine still have to pay America for them?

 

I don't know what you mean by that

This is Day-1, so its a little premature to say. Of course if they run, they lose. That much is certain. That's why I said they need to find their "spirit of winter war". It means unity and resolve, - no running and no giving up & everyone fights for the common goal. It should be easier for them to motivate themselves because they are fighting for their country, homes and families. The aggressor is usually the one who has a hard time finding motivation.

 

well, yes, just for 8 years they shot at civilians in the Donbass and imported American weapons ... "And why us now?" they cannot understand.

in 2014 there was a referendum in the Donbass... It was decided to secede from Ukraine by a captured junta.

are you completely stupid? The Russian people sincerely support Putin... and now his rating will rise even more.

too late to judge. America has shown how to act. "Quod licet Iovi (Jovi), non licet bovi" (c) Russi it's not a bull. It's more like a bear that has been teased for too long ... now "run fools!"

 

del-ete

 

I hope this war bankrupts Russia.

 

And now my thoughts. You know, the operation in Ukraine came as a surprise to me... That didn't foretell anything at all. In the morning, while driving to work, I listened to the radio - no prerequisites. And just an hour later, already at the local forum, combat reports rained down. I barely had time to track - I was three hours behind the real time.
In the evening, forget all the broadcasts on the radio with an analysis of the military operation and especially the consequences for Russia. No optimism.

 

Sorry, in parts wrong content!
What is correct is that the Red Army suffered massive casualties and it took far longer than Stalin thought to defeat the Finns. We could now philosophize for a long time about what was the reason for the failure of the Red Army, especially with regard to the Stalinist purge in the Red Army in terms of the officer corps and thus the effectiveness and ability of the leadership, etc.
Unlike the Baltic states, Stalin did not intend to conquer all of Finland. He was concerned with Karelia and areas that he wanted and where Finland in the negotiations ... if you can call that a negotiation ... refused. And in the end he got that in 1940 and kept it after the end of WWII and it's still part of Russia to this day.