Saving Democracy is not the most important thing on the ballot in the midterms....

It's the ONLY important thing on the ballot. Everything else comes second.

Whatever issue is important to you (real issues, not fascist dreams). Be it Climate Change, taxes, guns, women's rights, inflation, civil liberties or personal liberties, ... NONE of that matters if we lose Democracy and the Rule of Law.

I leave it up to you to imagine what will ultimately happen when you can no longer choose your leaders, and when the rule of law no longer applies to them anymore.

 

G, I'm not really sure they understand that our country, itself, is at stake and their inability to look beyond their intense hatred and bigotry is clouding their judgment. The United States of America that we grew up in will be gone. Not theatrics. Not histrionic. Not hyperbole.

 

I get the feeling the only democracy the left will accept is if they win all the time. And it’s the same tired talking points every friggin day; everything is a threat to democracy, even the Georgia election law. Say, how is that turning out? I hear voter turnout is through the roof.

Anyway, I don’t think libs understand the definition of democracy.


Democrats: The Only Way To Save Democracy Is One-Party Rule
https://thefederalist.com/2022/10/25/democrats-the-only-way-to-save-democracy-is-one-party-rule/

 

Americans are voting out the woke leftist Democrats all over the country who are all enemies of the constitution.
Woke lefties like Fetterman who wants to empty the prisons and his wife who thinks swimming pools are racist.
Woke Basement dwellers like Katie Hobbs of Arizona who cost the taxpayers millions for her racist history and crushed by Republican Kari Lake
They even had to reach into the bucket to get Obama to go to Pennsylvania to stop the bleeding but its not working

American voters are explaining to the left why they are done with wokeism. While your definition of Democracy is Democrats having control of everything, I think the voters have seen enough of Bidens booming economy that is Historical inflation, Historical gas prices, Historical grocery prices, and Historical illegal crossings.

So while you play pretend games like Russia did it, the voters know better and have responded.

 

Boy, are you going to be disappointed.

 

Hard to say what the repercussions of a red wave of clueless Republicans would be. Though it would fit the cycle of President in, mid-term opponent win. Generally easier to run against someone than back up your dead beat ideas.

I mean if Republicans win, they will generally have the worst favorability. It’s not like they have any ideas outside dictating their worldview on schools that the studentry doesn’t even like. They just like to complain a lot, and will continue to be whiney bitches even when in power.

Even if they take power it can’t last long. Sophistry only gets you so far.

 

But your parameter for being "enemies of the constitution" does not include January 6 insurrectionists who tried to overthrow the result of a democratic election in a ceremonial act that is dictated by the constitution.. So that doesn't tell us much.

 

The problem is that Republicans don't NEED ideas. They just need to obstruct. The American people have come to accept that Republicans don't do anything except obstruct. They have also accepted that Republicans commit crimes that go unpunished, and that they use lies and conspiracy theories to fool voters. If Republicans win control of Congress, it will have been proven that there are enough gullible voters in this country to keep them in power by doing what they do. And this would be compounded if the criminals from the past administration are not brought to justice very very soon.

 

Democrat politicians have the uncanny ability to become so repulsive to voters that they will even vote Republican to punish and remove the DP from power.
All RP pols have to do to win now is chant the rather obvious truth: 'The DP Sucks!'

 

You notice how they never talk of the Republic

 

Oh, you need clarity? Allow me to fill in the blanks
Yeah, I mean the ones who attacked the capital.
I also mean the Democrats who tried to get electors to falsify their votes PUBLICLY by running actual adds in the media in 2016 to overturn the results of an election
I also mean the Democrats who tried to vote out the electors in joint session in 2016 to overturn the results of the election
I also mean the Democrats who falsified documents to federal judges to get illegal FISA warrants to overturn the results of an election
I also mean the Democrats who hosted a fake Russian conspiracy for 3 years to overturn the results of an election
I also mean the Democrat who attacked the SCOTUS to stop Kavanaugh from being confirmed
I also mean the Democrats who start the impeachment process the day of inauguration to overturn the results of an election

Seems Democrats have memories about as long as their Johnsons

 

Most independents think saving democracy is nothing more than Democratic Party propaganda trying to scare folks into voting for them. To independents the most important issue this midterm is inflation, rising prices, the economy in general. When one is experiences thinning to flat wallets and having trouble making end meet, fulfilling ones needs and that of the family today, what may or may not happen at sometime in the future is irrelevant. If I can’t make through today, tomorrow doesn’t matter.


What’s the worst thing that can happen if the Republicans regain control of the house? Gridlock, stalemate. Nothing more and nothing less. Biden will govern by executive order like Obama did his last six years making for the most part congress irrelevant. Life goes on.


We all know Republicans want the GOP in control of congress, Democrats want the democrats in control. What do independents, the non-affiliated, less to non-partisans want? Republican in control of the house by a 31-26 margin with the rest not caring. The senate 29-25 Republican with the rest, no opinion, no preference. Why are independents, swing voters important, they decide elections for the most party. With both major party’s affiliation down around 30% each, swing voters are becoming more decisive in elections. Perhaps the more important question to both major parties is why are they both shrinking while independents are rising? From 30% of the electorate in 2006 to 43% today.


https://docs.cdn.yougov.com/sp4h6s0adp/econTabReport.pdf

 

I am cautious about drawing too many conclusions from this tidbit of information.

Does this REALLY mean that the number of voters that are 50/50 in regards to which way they vote depending on the candidate has risen from 30% to 43%, or does it simply mean that it has become more en vogue to call oneself an independent despite the reality that most of those people still almost always vote one way or the other.

I tend to think of it as the latter. You see a lot of those "independents" on here who are constantly arguing in favor of one side over the other. I do not believe for one second that people in general have gotten MORE open minded over that time period.

 

I understand where you’re coming from. One thing you need to realize is most independents aren’t political junkies and don’t express their opinions on sites like this one. Usually most don’t pay any attention to the daily grind going on in Washington until an election nears. But a study of independents show they can be broken down into three groups. Independents lean Republican, independents leans Democratic and independents with no leans or what I refer to as true or pure independents. As to the number or percentage in each group is dynamic and changes constantly. The big difference is history shows those who affiliate or call themselves Republicans and or Democrats vote for their party’s candidates 94% of the time. Independents who lean toward one party or the other vote for the candidates of the party they lean toward on average 72% of the time. Pure or true independents, who the heck knows. They’re all over the place, no way to figure out their average.


This is old, from September as Gallup hasn’t provided any recent updates. Of the 43% of those who say their independents 41% leans toward the Republicans, 45% toward the Democrats with but 14% in the pure/true independent column with no leans. There’s a huge difference of 19 out of 20 for those who identify as Republicans and Democrats voting for their party’s candidates and the 14 out of 20 among independents who lean toward one party or the other. Also, you can see huge difference from election cycle to election cycle in the way independents vote. Since we’re dealing with midterms, Independents in 2006 independents voted Democratic by a margin of 57-39 over Republicans. Yet 4 years later in 2010, independents voted 56-37 Republican over Democratic.

The two most recent midterms, 2014 independents voted 54-42 for Republican congressional candidates, but in 2018 independents voted for the Democratic congressional candidates by a 54-42 margin. Between 2006 and 2010 you had a swing of 37 points. From plus 18 democratic to minus 17 democratic. Between 2014 and 2018, the swing was less, 24 points from a plus 12 for the republicans to a minus 12 for the republicans. But still, a 24-point swing is huge. Exactly what percentage of independents are willing to swing back and forth is hard to pinpoint. Perhaps 15-20% with the rest voting for the party they lean toward.

 

No you don't! You've been justifying and cheering for the insurrectionists since the day of the failed coup.

We already know your parameter: "If it pleases the idol, you're in favor. If it displeases the idol, you're against". You have not shown a SHRED of independent thinking... EVER. And there are few posters, even on the right, for whom I can say that.

 

FAKE CLAIM
You can't find a single post I have made supporting that claim.

Yes, we all know your ability to post what everyone thinks

So show us some of this independent thinking you claim is so important to you.
What do you think of the following
Democrats who tried to get electors to falsify their votes PUBLICLY by running actual adds in the media in 2016 to overturn the results of an election
Democrats who tried to vote out the electors in joint session in 2016 to overturn the results of the election
Democrats who falsified documents to federal judges to get illegal FISA warrants to overturn the results of an election
Democrats who hosted a fake Russian conspiracy for 3 years to overturn the results of an election
Democrat who attacked the SCOTUS to stop Kavanaugh from being confirmed
Democrats who start the impeachment process the day of inauguration to overturn the results of an election

 

Inflation, rising prices and the state of the economy is a temporary matter. Losing democracy and the rule of law is permanent. If we lose democracy (and more than two thirds of Americans, according to polls, believe that is a real danger), inflation and the economy will not be something you can address with your vote. So politicians won't care. Do you think Putin cares if Russians are feeling the pain in their wallet due to the Ukraine war?

If traditional Republicans were to gain the house, that would be the case. But it's MAGA-Republicans who would control it. These are very different times. If MAGA-extremists control both chambers, they can legislate to perpetuate themselves in power REGARDLESS of how you vote. They can easily get rid of the President in the next elections and then perpetuate in power the MAGA-President they prefer.

From there to complete disregard for rule of law is a very easy step.

Once we get to that point, independents won't matter. NO voter will matter. In fact, to get there independents will be more useful to the anti-democracy crowd.

 

That depends on one’s situation doesn’t it. Right now, independents are dissatisfied with Biden and company for a variety of reasons. How does one go about expressing thei dissatisfaction? Certainly not voting for them. Had the Democrats who are in full control, perhaps if they governed for America as a whole instead of just for their base, we may not have this conversation.


It isn't only the democrats that govern just for their base, so too do the Republicans. We get into this habit of voting in one party in one election and then out the next election. In our two-party system, the party out of power is the only alternative to the party in power. Would you vote for a party that you thought was doing a lousy job at governing? Making your life worse off than what it was when the party in power first gained power. Midterms are a referendum on the party in power. Not on the party out of power, they are just the only alternative available. Do a good job, make most folks happy, they’ll vote to retain the party in power. Do the opposite, have them become unhappy with you, with the job your doing, making their life worst, they’ll vote for the party out of power. Simple logic.

 

Are you cheering for the FBI?

 

I think it's absurd to use your vote to express dissatisfaction (or, for that matter, satisfaction). You use your vote to elect whoever you think is more likely to solve the problem. Even voting for whoever you think is less likely to make it worse would make sense. If you think a Republican Congress with a Democratic President fit the bill, then that's what you vote for.

But, whether you vote for who you think might solve the problem, or you vote to express dissatisfaction (which doesn't make the least bit of sense), you WON'T have that if we lose our Democracy.... EVER!

Right! And the reason people do that is because they think that their vote is meant to express dissatisfaction. Which is absurd!

Absolutely! If I thought the other party would be even worse. There is no indication that we will have more than two major parties any time soon. But there is a clear danger that we might have only ONE.

To many people it is. And that's the MOST absurd of all possible ways you can use your vote. I mean, "punishing" the party in power by making things WORSE?

Let's be clear here: NOBODY is going to do a good job that will make folks happy. If ANY party were ever to do that, they have would been winning elections for decades based on merits. But if there is a party that can make things WORSE.... that's who you vote AGAINST.

You hit the nail on the head above. People vote for one party in one election cycle, then for the other, then they change back... EXPECTING that one of them will work for THEM. This will NEVER happen. What happens when they do this is that the worst party won't care about losing their vote this time, because they know they'll get it next time around. So they have NO incentive to do things better. Because they know that NO party can have a "perfect" administration for 8 years... most often not even for 4. There will ALWAYS be... something... that people don't like and they think they should "punish" them for. No matter how hard they try. And the response to that is voting for the party that they KNOW won't even try.

 

Another "your side sucks". "No...your side sucks". "No....YOUR side does". "No....yours does" thread. Grown a55 adult arguing like phucking 5 yr olds. This country really is doomed.

 

LOL @ the Don Quixote Left tilting at its "saving democracy" windmill.

And next Wednesday Lefties will be blaming everyone and everything but themselves for the ass-kicking our democracy handed them.

 

And it very well could be the LAST ass-kicking it gives us. The next ass-kicking could very well come, not from democracy, but from extremist partisan judges and justices, and from a Republican controlled Congress REGARDLESS of what democracy dictates.

 

Ironic. Nothing says "power to the people" like 87K new IRS agents, higher taxes, vax mandates, and gun control.

 

Yes the only thing that's important on the ballot is whether you vote for leftist authoritarianism or not.

Calling it democracy to make it seem like it's something people should be comfortable with is deceitful.