New study supports social contagion theory for surge in teen girls identifying as transgender

People will do what people will do. Worry about your own life, and let others worry about theirs.
Sure, they may regret things later, but that is part of their life path. Good and bad decisions are all part of our journey.
Some of the soldiers I served with lost limbs, and are seriously screwed up for life. Should we have persuaded them not to join the military to begin with, because it might “wreck” their life? Are they less human because of the decisions they made? No. It is no different for gay, trans, or whatever. If they do something they regret later, we’ll, that is part of their life process. Maybe some would regret their life more if they didn’t do those things.
The point is, everyone is on their own path, and needs to make their own decisions, for good or Ill. What may seem like a terrible decision for some may be the right decision for others.

 

The post really needs to stop at the part in bold.

1. I admit I didn't read everything. So why the hell should we put any credence in anything you have to say on the topic?
2. "But to me" To you? What is your training in human psychology? Where is your expertise in transgenderism? Again, why are we to put any credence in what you have to say on the topic?

 

It's very simple. Up until now being TG was seriously frowned upon. My opinion is that the number of people who are transgendered has not increased, society just now allows them to be open about their feelings.

 

You forgot one more possible scenario. When people see others "coming out" for something they feel they are it can embolden them to be honest about who they believe they really are. For example, when it became more "acceptable" to be gay at the teen age level (meaning less bullying) there wasn't a sudden explosion in teen homosexuality. It was just that those who were gay now felt safer being who they are and being "out" about it. Back when I was in high school (1980s) no one was "out" in my high school. I'm now friendly with two from my class who are gay and knew they were gay in high school but were scared to come out then.

Now, for those who live in a black and white world, no....I don't support the idea that one can change their gender. But I also don't spend my time wringing my hands and getting all upset over those who believe they can change their gender.

 

There is also a third option, as society begins to move away from targeted harassment and moves more to tolerance people will find what makes them happy and accept it.

Homosexuality for example has been seen in physical tests that measure arousal in men at around 10% for decades. That we are seeing these same figures now in self assessment whereas it was around 2% when homosexuality was illegal shows this was the issue.

With trans people there is no prior metric or way to measure that I am aware of. We need to move to a position where they have equal rights but not more rights and that every possible avenue is explored prior to medically transitioning.

On to a personal note, no one is going to take any study you post seriously with you calling others “trannies”. Some people take their own lives over not feeling like their body matches their brain (or soul).

 

It could well be a factor. I seriously doubt that the number has not increased.

 

Everytime we prohibit a 16-year-old from buying booze, that is us (through our elected representatives) interfering with the lives of others.

To be clear, when it comes to adults you and are see eye-to-eye on that. You leave me alone, and I'll leave you alone. Whether your are straight, gay, in between, trans, like sci-fi, or romantic comedies, prefer orgies or church... I simply do not care. But when it comes to allowing children to do dumb $hit, we have always had different rules for them than for adults, and for good cause. This is one of those. If people wanna play dress-up, so be it. That's their issue, and their problem. But, the thing is, if/when they decide that was dumb (like we do when we grow up and realize that we did a LOT of dumb stuff when younger), clothes can be changed. A dickectomy cannot.

I wouldn't even mind if we don't allow people to surgically transition until at least they are old enough to buy that booze, it's only a 3-year gap, but what a 3 years it is. When you're talking about someone who is 41, a 38-year-old is for all practical purposes identical. But that's not true when it's 21 and 18. But that is a different discussion about when is adulthood, and why do we have so many different standards? To become a soldier, it's 18, but to drink it's 21. To get charged as an adult for a crime, it's usually 16, but for the extra-heinous ones, I've heard of it going as young as 13. Now, maybe when it comes to people who are so broken that they think nothing at all about using violence to get their way, or simply for fun, maybe... that is different. But if you are not mature enough to decide to have a drink at 18, I sure don't want you voting. We should pick a single age, with all the assistance we can get from modern medicine, and stick with it, possibly with exceptions for people who are literally broken in the manner they are willing to behave.

It may be a bit hypocritical, but if you are 15-years-old, and you just finished shooting up a kindergarten (hypothetical example, I'm not talking about any specific case), perhaps special rules apply to you in terms of crime and punishment, but not for buying or using booze. But it was 18 for eons before MADD got it changed back in the 80s, indeed, when I visited Japan in 2000, there were beer machines outside bodegas that were available 24x7 that any child (or teenager) could put some money in and walk away with a beer, to my knowledge it wasn't a problem for them, so maybe that is the proper age.

Anyway, I simply do not like children making such life-changing ideas at such a young age, and I don't want to hear reports 15 years from now about a pandemic of regret from then 30-35-year-olds who transitioned as a teen.

If that is really the right solution, waiting a few years isn't going to cause them any harm. But doing it a few years too soon might.

 

Well for o e thing medically maiming the mentally ill for profit strikes me as an absolutely horrible idea. Especially when there is no evidence that it makes there lives significantly or even moderately better

 

Nonsense. Abnormality is being encouraged normality discouraged.

 

1. How is "normality" being discouraged?
2. What is wrong with "abnormality" being encouraged?

I have an IQ over 130...that is abnormal....but shouldn't it be encouraged? I am left handed, that is "abnormal" (only about 15% of the population is left handed) why shouldn't that be encouraged?

I am a HUGE fan of Star Trek. A philosophy that comes out of Star Trek is known as IDIC (Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations). Basically it means that being different is not necessarily a bad thing. Different combinations of talents and viewpoints can lead to better solutions. Do you disagree?

 

While I too approach life with the live and let live mantra, it depends upon whom is the person making this decision to me. If it is my adult neighbor? It doesn't matter to me one way or the other what life choices they make for themselves. If it turns out that they are making a colossal mistake that they later regret, or if it is their path to happiness makes no difference to me. They are entirely free to live their life as they see fit and they can live with the consequences of their decision. It is no skin off my nose one way or the other.

However, If it were my preteen child that wanted to chemically halt puberty, it is very much my business and I care to a great degree whether or not it is their true internal self versus some wild a** delusion.

I know when I argue against the notion of a child halting their puberty or when I express skepticism of whether or not this is little more than a delusion, I think of myself as a parent and how I would react to my child if they wanted to start this process. Based on your stated position, it looks as if you approach the concept as if it is your neighbor that has no real bearing on you.

Just because you approach the subject as if it is your neighbor and hence you could not care less, does not change the reality that if it were your child you would not take the same live and let live approach. By approaching it from that perspective, in truth, you are sidestepping the actual debate. The actual debate is not dependent upon your relationship to the person making this decision, rather it is about whether or not life-altering decisions are being made by mentally ill people that are suffering from a delusion, or whether this is their true internal self.

Personally, I suspect that there are some that are legitimate, and many more that are just delusions born out of mental illness. Since there is no way of truly knowing, there is not a chance in hell that I would allow my preteen child to make such a decision and to subsequently halt puberty. I would barely let my preteen child go to the mall alone. Much less am I going to let them decide to halt their biological processes.

 

Absurd. One of those variants is homicidal mania, how much variation do you want? Mentally ill is mentally ill. The real question you ought be asking your self is why so many people in your brave new world are so desperately unhappy with themselves?

 

I think this is a very important discussion, but I suspect whatever I say will be glossed over. I've had friends who have transitioned from as far back as ~2000 (when I experienced this the first time). I guess if people want to know my beliefs, I'm Catholic, Trump supporter, and married to a Jewish Democrat. I generally believe that people have the right to do, and be whatever they want to be. It's not for me to judge, or tell people that the way the dress is wrong, so long as they are not violating basic decency that I think any reasonable person from any political perspective would support.

I don't know why, but the prevalence of transgender people in my life has been pretty significant, and I've always supported them. I'm in the tech industry, so that could have a lot to do with it. Here are my observations... with the exception of only 1 out of 5... four of them had pre-existing mental disorders. Everything from severe Obsessive Compulsion Disorder (for which they were being treated medically), to literally all of them having Asperger's syndrome. Most of them also suffered from depression. Three of them all regretted having gone through the process (as in, the full surgery). They were unhappy after doing it, and regretted their decision, stating that they thought this would make them happy, and it did not. These three individuals also took their own lives. At least four of them were genius-level, extremely high IQs, but socially awkward and introverted.


There's a couple of thoughts I have...
- I saw a study that said 57% of the country suffers from some form of mental illness. Why has this number increased?
- Is our food the problem?
- Are people in America being overmedicated? Is it the drugs being flushed down the toilet and going into our water supply?


Final thoughts:

My daughter is also in middle school, and we occasionally have conversations about this. The overwhelming vast majority of her friends are something other than "hetero." When I was in high school in the mid 90s, there were gay people, and we didn't really think anything of it. No one cared. I don't think anyone even really thought about sex in middle school, but whatever... probably irrelevant. But I do question WHY it's so common now. It's statistically impossible that the majority of the people in my daughter's school are gay or transgender, or other. So this could be two things...
1 - It's become trendy, specifically because being something other than hetero means that you are a victim, which means you get a special status.
2 - It's influencing children (improperly), who are in sort of the "discovery" phase of their childhood where they're trying to figure out who they are.

Regardless, my daughter is a friend to all, and she treats them all with respect, and her closest friends are (whatever it is). One of her best friends is a girl that identifies as a boy, whom is dating a boy that identifies as a girl. So in reality, it's a hetero relationship... but it's just a thing they're doing.


Either way, I have strong opinions on allowing children to transition before they're 18... as in, making physical or chemical changes to their bodies. Children are basically idiots... though adults don't seem to be too much better these days... but children are causing irreversible damage to their bodies, and parents are encouraging it. It should be a decision that's made when they're adults, and have a better picture and understanding of who they are, or what they want to be.


Note, this seems to be a thing that is most prevalent in the United States... I think we all need to take a step back and look at this critically. Including Democrats. We can still support people, but this is becoming something other than people discovering themselves. We're starting to see a mass psychosis take shape in our country.

 

I'm personally fine with banning medical transitions until the child is an adult. It's medically dangerous to screw with your body during puberty and the results of doing so are irreversible.

 

sorry, hard to tell sometimes, people really think like that saddly, my mistake

 

yet, it;'s the right and people like Trump that want just that... an authoritarian government

Trump said he wanted the American people to treat him like North Korea treats their leader

 

As if trans people change their sex on a whim....

And even if it were, it would be none of your business.

 

Homosexuality has been with us forever. Gender reassignment by surgery, not so much.

Sure J. Edgar and Bill Clinton and many others like to cross dress, but I don't think that's the same thing.

 

By undermining the concept of objective reality.

 

It is my business if my family or friends are being harmed by this trans craze.

 

That has got to be the silliest thing I've read all day. Societies exist because they impose a vision of society on others.

 

Do you think Trump had the election stolen from him?

 

This is the principle of law.

But the basis of a society is that individuals join together to ensure their security.

Moral prejudices came much later, when conservatism appeared.

Homophobia is a flaw, not a right that deserves compensation.

 

You have no idea how close you are to advocating an authoritarian, one party government. Yes, Trump has his issues, but his faults pale in comparison to the threats posed by weaponizing the judiciary. You will scoff at this, but I wish would give it some thought.

 

Then it sounds like you should have read some of the research that Bowerbird provided, instead of just relying on a questionable study, because you like its conclusion. While it is possible that the influence of one's peers have an effect, that is certainly not a full explanation, and does not go to the source (the reason why this would manifest now). The same flaw exists in your other explanations: mental issues, birth defects, or social pressure. I will grant that one of your suggestions, a national campaign of "brainwashing," could conceivably be considered as a precipitating factor, however that notion smacks of conspiracy theory, and seems far less believable than hormonal disruption, due to chemicals, ubiquitous in our society, which have been documented to cause this effect, in humans. In frogs, which are more sensitive to these chemicals, the effect is much more dramatic, and has been known for a many years.

Do yourself a favor, if you prefer not being ignorant, and do just a little research. You wouldn't need pore over involved scientific papers-- just Google "research on human hormone-disrupting chemicals." I mean, if you are sincerely curious about likely causes of the phenomenon, as you claim, in your OP.