Avdiivka, Longtime Stronghold for Ukraine, Falls to Russians

As Russia pushes forward, Ukrainian soldiers say U.S. aid delays have left them exposed
A shortage of ammunition has contributed to the loss of the eastern city of Avdiivka and eroded morale among units that find themselves outmanned and outgunned.

...

NBC News spoke to five soldiers across the war's more than 600 miles of front lines, as well as military analysts, who offered a bleak assessment of Ukraine’s prospects with support from its Western backers in doubt.

The soldier in the south, a drone operator, said that if he spots Russian movement in his area, Ukrainian artillery units fire a few rounds in response — enough to frighten but not destroy them.

Facing a shortage of rounds, he said they try to substitute artillery fire with small handmade bombs strapped to the drones that they then drop on the Russians.

... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...ine-soldiers-us-aid-ammo-shortages-rcna138539​

The Putin wing of the Trump Party is setting Ukraine up to lose ground and lives unnecessarily.

 

It's an overplayed trope and a bullshit excuse.

Australia has Nazis too. Look:






Oh no! Australia has a Nazi problem! Somebody please invade us!

 

Good heavens .. Mr Paine would be horrified .. the thought of the likes of these apologists for atrocity and violators of the founding principle.. quoting him .. haters of the Rule of Law .. Moral righteousness .. and the teachings of our lord and savior.

Mr. Paine would not be a fan of Genocide Joe .. Nor the Blue Cancel Crew .. all drunk of fallacious utilitarian stew .. down the collectivist road to fascism.

 

Wow -- you really believe this long debunked "Russia Russia" propaganda from Hillary and the Blue Hoard. That is sad friend but good news .. I am here to set you straight ! an I bet you can not wait ! ..

LOok ... Washington .. is a pay to play system. U Understand ? Pay .. to Play -- as long as you play along with "The Donor Class" you get paid .... and everyone knows it. .. no one wants to shoot the golden goose friend . or very few .. the Tulsi Gabbards and Rand Paul's .. running against herd of stampeding Bulls and we saw how that worked out .. cept you have to give it to Paul .. like the energizer bunny .. takes a licken and keeps on ticken .. keeps getting up for more.

U Understand ? --- don't go nowhere near the Presidential chair in this place without the backing of at least some significant members of "The Donor Class"

"Donor Class" --- Durandal .. Do you think Putin is part of that club .., and if so ..what do you figure his relative significance would be ?

 

Holy terrible argument and ridiculously false analogy !

A few fellows in halloween costumes riding the Subway .. calling themselves "Bad Guys" of some sort or another --- is not a State Sponsored Nazi Militia going around executing people of the wrong ethnic persuation,, leading to eventual civil war between the two groups.

Did these Subway Clowns make it onto the US Terrorist Watch list .. congress forbidding the funding/arming of this group .. like with the Azov Nazi's ?

 

That is a Kremlin naZi fairy tale, of course. Nazis always lie as an excuse to invade and steal other people's land.

 

So as we see YOUR "For as Long as it takes" comes to mean nothing but a cheap LIE
So YOU admit as far as YOU are concerned, Ukraine can lose, and YOU really
don't give a do YOU ! - So long as the Russia loses too & the USofA wins.

Well THAT says it all ! - Exactly as the "Rand Report" projects. We can
USE the Ukraine like a piece of toilet paper to bring harm to Russia.
------------------------------------------------------------
Overextending and Unbalancing Russia
Assessing the Impact of Cost-Imposing Options
https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB10014.html
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We could sponsor a Neo Nazi Banerite Coup and provoke a Russian response
& then we can ruin them with our Sanctions, and NATO armed Ukrainian Blood

This was the plan, but it didn't quite work out the way YOU had hoped, did it Jack ?

And so you have brought Catastrophe and Ruin down upon the people of Ukraine
from which it will take centuries to recover. Whole generations have been obliterated

All YOUR horses and all YOUR men will NOT put this Humpty Dumpty together again


This whole Bloody War has been perpetrated by the USofA-- Just as that Human
Filth on feet, Linsey Graham, said: - For a small investment we can let Ukrainians
spend their Blood while we will reap long term Trillions in Profit$ and accomplish
................................................................................................... the bonus of hurting Russia.

It is exactly as the Russkies contend and the "Rand Report" outlined - YOU
USED the Ukraine in hopes to bring Economic, Military and Human misery
to Russia -- And any talk of Ukrainian Freedom is just a chew on YOUR own

..........................................
With THIS - YOU have EXPOSED YOURSELF
We see the diseased genitalia of such thought

IT was never about the Ukraine ? was IT Jack, they were just a shoe ?

.

.
.

 

As two years have passed since the start of the war, President Zelensky's approval ratings continue to decline. Some critics say, ''Zelensky lost his popularity because of his mistakes, and in the end, he will fall from power and pay the price.'' (Vitaly Klitschko/Kiev Mayor)

91% (February 27, 2022, Ratings) → 81% (October 2023, Gallup) → 62% (December 2023, Kiew Institute of Sociology).

 

What is this Kremlin Nazi Fairy tale you are talking about ? and what has it to fact that Avdiivka was encircled .. and now has fallen - the Ukrainian side making a bloody retreat .. just as you were told .. contrary to that propaganda fairy tale you been spinning.

Low on Ammo - Low on people - lost the sky - in an artillery battle with little artillery .. the enemy with 10 x the artillery .. control of the skies dropping 60 big Bombs a day .. a complete disaster with enormous casualties.

That is what your side is now reporting friend .. once again you are claiming that western mainstream media is spouting "Kremlin Propaganda".
This is ridiculous Russiaphobia .. and you have yet to understand what propaganda is .. .. Propaganda is not the Side telling the Truth Durandal .. it is the false stories you have been parroting.

What is this "Kremlin Fairy Tale" Durandal ? Ukraine is in retreat from Avdiivka - Just as you were told was happening .. after which you cried out "Kremlin Nazi Fairy Tale"

 

LOL -- Goat herders with sophisticated US technology Bill -- taking on old and dated Russian stuff ..

but .. OH No Zoomer .. them same Goat herders beat back OLD USA .. without the help of sophisticated military technology. What are we to do now .. with another screw-up from Genocide Joe ?

 

You need to lay off the Russian propaganda and disinformation Jack - be it from Russia or from the US congress .. which you also figured were Russian Propaganda and disinformation agents.

Look friend .. just because information conflicts with your western propaganda influenced perspective .. does not make it "Russian Propaganda and disinformation" >> OK ?

You do not seem to understand what propaganda is .. and so misuse the word .. for example .. where is the lie in the post you are responding to ? Where is this falsehood you are claiming is "Russian Propaganda" ?

 

you can be arrested for such talk....It's the 3 day special operation...!

...and...

 

You have established a new standard of silliness.

 

Yes, I said Russia lost long ago, which is true. But you claimed I said Ukraine would win, which is false.
Now, rather than simply admit the error you have tried to move the goalposts. Tsk tsk.
Russia lost the war very early, by creating a much more difficult strategic environment for themselves. Putin's strategic goal was to establish Russia's dominance in the "near abroad." He has achieved the opposite.

 

What the archives show is that James Baker said something beyond his authority and was immediately repudiated by President Bush.
More importantly, those discussions took place in the context of the continuing existence of the Soviet Union, which in fact ceased to exist, rendering all previous undertakings null and void.
With the end of the USSR the Baltic States were liberated and immediately sought shelter in NATO.

 

Mr. Paine and Mr. Mill are on the side of Ukraine.
“War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth a war, is much worse. When a people are used as mere human instruments for firing cannon or thrusting bayonets, in the service and for the selfish purposes of a master, such war degrades a people. A war to protect other human beings against tyrannical injustice; a war to give victory to their own ideas of right and good, and which is their own war, carried on for an honest purpose by their free choice, — is often the means of their regeneration. A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. As long as justice and injustice have not terminated their ever-renewing fight for ascendancy in the affairs of mankind, human beings must be willing, when need is, to do battle for the one against the other.”
― John Stuart Mill, Principles of Political Economy

 

Ukraine has a real prospect of victory; Russia does not.

 

Mill would probably argue that Ukraine is actually fighting to liberate Russia....

 

The entire first paragraph is false.
The First, Second and Third claims are false as well.

 

Are ukranian nationalists "nazi's"?

 

When a western source posts stories like this, you know it's bad:

Trapped and left for dead, injured Ukrainian soldiers in Avdiivka exchanged desperate messages as the town fell

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...an-avdiivka-soldiers-messages-intl/index.html

What's also likely is that, in publishing such as the above, that the West (read the U.S.) is abandoning its Ukraine project. We've already seen hints of that in Joe Biden blaming the Republicans for the loss in Adveevka.

As Dandy Don once said, "Turn out the lights, the party's over!"

 

Dude, if you seriously think you have never claimed Ukraine was going to win, I mean you posted this today:

Since the war started you've made multiple posts claiming inevitable Ukrainian victory. Now that military reality has finally started to permeate even the MSM, suddenly you're hedging. That would be fine if you weren't trying to pretend that you never said that Ukraine was going to win.

As far as your claim that "Russia lost long ago," that just seems categorically false and to me just seems that it's cope for calling this war so wrong after presenting yourself as an "expert" on this. I love your smug "we shall see" comments you've littered the forum with, because at this point we actually can see, and see you've either been spouting some sort of weird, illogical propaganda or you've been a victim of it, like a phone scam targeted at old people.

 

That is a mere falsehood. Disappointing but typical.

The prospect of victory =/= the inevitability of victory.

 

On this forum I can always tell when I've won the day and gotten the better of the argument when my opponent starts editing my replies to avoid responding to the edited out points.

By the way, that happens a lot.

 

As you wish. My intent was to focus on the actual point. The rest of your post seemed to just be a smokescreen. I have never claimed to be a military expert; your claim is just another falsehood. As for Ukraine vs Russia, what is indisputable is that Russia's strategic position now is significantly worse than before the war, while Ukraine's orientation to the West has likely become permanent.