Science Fiction Failures

Discussion in 'Science' started by HereWeGoAgain, Jun 14, 2020.

  1. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    What are sci-fi concepts or premises used, that clearly violate the laws of physics or don't make sense, and why?

    Perhaps the most common fail is the use of whooshing sounds or jet engines, when space ships fly by. Remember that in space, no one can hear you scream. And space ships don't make banking turns. The imagineers who create these shots are often thinking in terms of aerodynamics, like an aircraft would fly. But in space, there is no aero... :D

    We often see the use of time frozen or dramatically slowed down, so that the main characters can navigate a world seemingly frozen in time and stopped in motion. The problem is that if the world around them stopped as portrayed, it would also be pitch black. Photons would not be reflecting from the objects around them, traveling into their eyes and finally striking their optic nerves, so there would be no light.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
  2. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    I think if sci part of sci-fi was depicted realistically, it wouldn't have the fi appeal.
     
  3. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    There is a genre of hard science fiction that people like me like. But you have to be seriously hardcore LOL!!!

    For us, perhaps the best science fiction movie ever made as far as logical purity, was Primer.

    Primer is a 2004 American science fiction film about the accidental discovery of time travel. The film was written, directed, produced, edited and scored by Shane Carruth [BS Mathematics], who also stars with David Sullivan.

    Primer is of note for its extremely low budget, experimental plot structure, philosophical implications, and complex technical dialogue, which Carruth, a college graduate with a degree in mathematics and a former engineer, chose not to simplify for the sake of the audience.[4] The film collected the Grand Jury Prize at the 2004 Sundance Film Festival, before securing a limited release in the United States, and has since gained a cult following.[5]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primer_(film)
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
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  4. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. FTR, I am not a sci fi fan particularly, but the husband is. Particularly novels. So I'll refer him to Primer.
     
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  5. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    Warning: That was made on a $6000 budget. It is the most extreme example one can find for being only about the writing. :D

    I would also highly recommend The Perfect 46. It received wide acclaim from geneticists for its relevance and real questions we will soon face.

    https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-n...es-ethical-dilemmas-of-genetic-screening.html
     
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  6. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    I enjoy a really intriguing story - something that makes me think out of the box. Honestly, I could care less about the production level - unless its REALLY bad acting.
     
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  7. HereWeGoAgain

    HereWeGoAgain Banned

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    As for great story telling, I have been watching a series on Prime called Tales from the Loop that is very creative. It isn't in the realm of hard sci-fi by any means. Just the opposite, this is all about the people with no attempt to logically justify what is happening. It is surreal, confusing, intriguing, captivating at times, and often quite charming. Well worth taking a look... I had already started a thread about this in the media section.
    http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/tales-from-the-loop.573919/

    PS It is very slow to get going. It didn't really start grabbing my attention until nearly the end of the first episode.

    In a similar but much most mystical vein, I absolutely loved The OA, on Netflix. Very very creative but nothing logical about it!
     
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  8. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    I enjoy science fiction from the standpoint I enjoy criticizing the range of improbable.
    There are a handful, that while the science depicted is often improbable, have some interest in addressing issues of human morality... often more using the genre to question current beliefs, assumptions and practices for instance in offerings like Blade Runner, Gattaca, What Happened to Monday, and even Altered Carbon. Entertaining, not altogether believable, but ask interesting philosophical questions.
    My pet peeve in Sci Fi, all those of people smoking... particularly during space travel.
     
  9. smallblue

    smallblue Well-Known Member

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    Basically any flying vehicle that defies the laws of gravity.
    It's the stereotypical 'future' aesthetic in most movies.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2020
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  10. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Ludicrous speed...
     
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  11. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Keep in mind that the sci-fi genre is pretty vast. The familiar tropes are used to further the story along, but I like you, love it when filmmakers actually try to craft a well written story within the bounds of physics.

    Another very often overlooked trope is many space ship designs have elaborate windows to see the stars. The best criticism against this trope I ever heard is that it would be the equivalent putting screen doors on a submarine. Space is constantly filled with radiation, particularly gamma, and it affects everyone. A window would allow too much radiation to get through. A practical alternative is to use the ships water supply to shield its passengers from too much radiation exposure. However, I've often wondered why it would not be possible to create a magnetic field similar to the Earth's to shield the craft just like our planet does. It may not do much for actual physical debris, but it could lower the radiation exposure.
     
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  12. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    That was a good fun movie!
     
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  13. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I hate that smoking trope too. I think we can blame the original Alien movie for that. I know what they're trying to do by using that prop, after all, we're always going to have vices as part of human nature, the least they could do is to make it a modern prop that explores other aspects of human nature.
     
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  14. Cosmo

    Cosmo Well-Known Member

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    Crystal clear: Finding ways to protect crews from space radiation.
    https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/...crystal-clear-protection-from-space-radiation
     
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  15. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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  16. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Yep, while I enjoyed the Alien series for their creativity in depicting the set and the alien, the smoking bit seemed massively inconsistent with the future they were envisioning, leaving me asking...Why?

    While I found a number of issues with the film, I enjoyed the movie Blade Runner and glimpses of the future it depicted in the pre-CG days. Not a blockbuster when it came out, but it developed as a cult classic for good reasons. Part of what made it of interest to me was the philosophical question it explored... the product of the novel it was based on...’Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?’ by Philip K. Dick. Something as interesting today as in the 80’s in all the discussions and warning of AI tech, a question continued in the movie Ex Machina which I also enjoyed... what happen when AI becomes self aware?
     
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  17. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Probably, one of the bigger challenges to long distance/time travel beyond the radiation issue, will be the challenge of Gravity and there has yet been a SFY FI account that provides a depicted tech solution that would be a practical depiction consistent with known physics and the evolution of human physiology in earth’s gravity.
     
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  18. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    Have you seen the sci-fi series The Expanse? I believe it's been moved to Prime streaming, but it originated on the SyFy channel. This is the first time I've seen a sci-fi show use a vertical style of ship where continued acceleration creates the artificial gravity and space stations using centrifugal force. These two methods are the only ones we know of today to create artificial gravity. The only creative license they used was the fuel source.
     
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  19. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

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    There's also the movie Passengers with Chris Pratt and Jennifer Lawrence. That ship also used a very stylish centrifugal design to create gravity, unfortunately, they don't use the premise consistently throughout the movie.

    Zero gravity has so many wonderful aspects to enriching a good sci-fi story. The movie Gravity blew me away.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2020
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  20. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    I started watching when it was first airing, but lost interest; I tend not to maintain interest in episodic TV shows. That said, if we follow Einstein’s theories, continued acceleration would provide a means for creating artificial gravity mimicking that of the earth that would avoid the pitfalls of a centrifugal system, assuming you could solve the problem of the fuel required to maintain a constant acceleration.
    Long term 0G I think would be a difficult proposition for humans, if you expect them to readjust to gravity at some point... 0G has some detrimental effects on muscle atrophy and determination of bone density that is likely to be much more pronounced in long duration 0G travel exposure, and it’s not clear to me if those effects can be adequately mitigated with exercise regimes like those currently used on the ISS. I probably won’t be around to see it, but I will be curious what we will see/learn from a manned round trip to Mars if that ever happens... Over Xmas and Jan I was hospitalized for 6 weeks and was amazed at the amount of muscle atrophy I experienced from which, despite my following a fairly disciplined effort to recondition my self, I have yet to fully recover to my preHospitalization level of physical conditioning, am about 90-95%, but that was just 6 weeks. I can’t imagine a year or more.
     
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  21. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    'The History of Time Travel' is pretty good. Its a documentary about the guy who created a time machine, and the 'history' keeps changing every time he uses it and so the documentary starts getting really confusing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2020
  22. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Number one in my book is weird ass space ship designs where the ship accelerates or travels in one direction and 'down' is orientated at exactly 180 degrees to that i.e as if they were were on Earth in a normal gravitational field. Think the Enterprise or Firefly. In reality the most efficient design would involve ships orientated along the axis of acceleration if only to minimize the potential for impacts via radiation and physical objects in the line of flight. That and space battles' where the only apparent result of an ballistic impact or other weapon hit is an Earth like 'explosion ' on the surface of the vessel followed some random control panel blowing up in a shower of sparks.
     
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  23. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    My own pet peeve is the use of weapons inside of a space craft. If firing pulses of light can take down someone wearing armor then those same light pulses are going to pierce the hull and cause decompression.

    I was sufficiently young and impressionable when I saw 2001: A Space Odyssey on the new large format movie screens. It effectively raised the bar for what otherwise had always been those awful low budget productions like the green slime.
     
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  24. Shook

    Shook Well-Known Member

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    According to IMDB, t had a budget of $7000, grossed $424,760 in the US and $545,436 worldwide.That's a good movie.
     
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  25. Cosmo

    Cosmo Well-Known Member

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    I bought the 2001 soundtrack after I saw the film in 68; I still have it.
    In 2013 Keir Dullea and Gary Lockwood were interviewed by Alec Baldwin on his short-lived late night show. If the video in the link doesn't work click on the word Transcript and at least you'll be able to read what was said in the interview.
    http://www.nbcnews.com/video/up-late-with-alec-baldwin/53437034#transcript
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2020
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