So why in God's name is the US not banning travel from UK to stop new strain?

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by chris155au, Jan 4, 2021.

PF does not allow misinformation. However, please note that posts could occasionally contain content in violation of our policies prior to our staff intervening. We urge you to seek reliable alternate sources to verify information you read in this forum.

  1. apexofpurple

    apexofpurple Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2018
    Messages:
    5,552
    Likes Received:
    7,641
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'm in favor of banning all public travel to the US.
     
  2. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Including American citizens coming back from where ever on this planet?
     
  3. apexofpurple

    apexofpurple Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2018
    Messages:
    5,552
    Likes Received:
    7,641
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Since they are citizens I'd say if they'd submit to staying in a quarantine facility (as in not their own home) for 3-4 weeks they could come back.
     
    Mandelus likes this.
  4. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good and agreed ... but this quarantine can be done inside the US too at least in my opinion.
    And thinking further of it ... it can be done for others too inside the US. Remember that there is a bunch of people with valid and well-reasoned issues to entry the US ... not some sort of tourists or whatever travelers I mean.
    Look for example about Truck drivers on US-Mexican border delivering issues to and from Mexico with their need to travel then back into the US and no matter if the driver is US or Mexican or whatever citizen. How to handle this? ;-)
     
  5. apexofpurple

    apexofpurple Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2018
    Messages:
    5,552
    Likes Received:
    7,641
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We've had a problem with Mexican trucks/drivers for a long time. Their trucks typically aren't maintained meaning unsafe and pollution prone and their native drivers aren't always held to the same standards of licensing and road time compliance as ours are. The USMC was supposed to address this but with Pres Biden in office its entirely possible provisions that would place limitations on Mexican trucks/drivers would be eliminated or just not activated. IMO we should imports from Central America the same way we handle things at sea ports; everything comes into a controlled area, its identified, inspected, sorted, and sent out by our people. In doing so we could eliminate the nearly 8 million entries into the US by Mexican trucks and their drivers.
     
  6. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Okay ...
    Even the problems you mentioned have nothing to do with Corona and, conversely, there are also allegations against the USA in the world ... you are hopefully aware that this will be massively expensive and need to build up a massive infrastructure for it first ... and that delivery times will be considerably extended (keyword "Just in Time Delivery for example) too?
    A good example for it we have currently between the UK and the EU after the Brexit was done now ... From both sides, nearly no trucks are driving from the UK to the EU and in reverse with the ferries and in the channel tunnel ... only the trailers are loaded and then taken over by local drivers on the other side. This is currently causing a delay of 10 to 14 days in moment (and I speak out of own experience from my job in purchasing now!) and so causing several problems in term of delivery punctuality and delivery reliability.
     
  7. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes, because it's the President's job to come with disease control procedures! If that was the case, there would be no more America! The people who were ACTUALLY in charge screwed up enough, without having a non-disease expert President being in charge!:roflol: You don't know how government works!
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2021
  8. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Who is "they?"
     
  9. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'm guessing that the the new added restriction is that the excepted people now have to be tested, whereas before they didn't.
     
  10. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ehm ... is the POTUS in charge for such procedures to order? Yes he is and no one else, becase this is a federal issue of his responsibility by US law only!
    Please learn first the real facts by law befre telling me I don't know how governments works!
     
  11. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes, and are you saying that his CDC approached him with an order which they wanted him to sign, and he said no?
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2021
  12. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Right this happened ... CDC told quarantaine but this fool ignored!
    But even if not ... it was more as well-known with these 14 days time span at this time and Trump as Potus should have enough brain cells in the head to recognize this all by his own ... you know this fool who always told that he knows all better and is the best and greatest expert for all and everything during the last 4 years!
     
  13. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Can you support that claim?

    All because of the 14 day incubation period? This alone means that he should be able to design Disease Control policy? Surely you can't be serious!

    Yes, but he's wrong!
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2021
  14. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I have to search for it more intense, but here another example of CDC vs. Trump ...

    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/07/tru...cdc-guide-to-reopening-the-country.html#close

    Really? How did Corona come so massively into the USA suddenly and about 2 weeks later when Trump made the entry ban for China, please?
    Ask this as first step by your own ...
    Then we have the fact tha about 40,000 US citizens and other people with valid visa / green card came back from China after this travel ban. This is OK, because why shall they stay in China for several weeks and month?
    Only ... these people were all not tested for Corona, because there was no rapid test existing. It was only often checked if they have fever and thats it ... but being infected means not to have directly fever as you know.

    So why the hack was this 14 days quarantaine not done against all existing knowledge at this time please? And this is now serious, because to set such an order is the responsibility of the POTUS due to federal law!
     
    chris155au likes this.
  15. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2020
    Messages:
    7,707
    Likes Received:
    3,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The US Center for Disease Control and Prevention.
     
    chris155au likes this.
  16. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yeah, but does that mean that once people get the vaccine, they will likely still catch COVID?
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
  17. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Have you heard of the White House Coronavirus Taskforce?

    Not sure. Are you saying that the entry ban made things worse?

    So what do you suggest should have happened in the early stage? No exemptions whatsoever? A total travel ban where not even US citizens could have returned home?

    You'd have to ask the CDC and other relevant agencies.

    Yes, it requires the President to sign such orders, but that doesn't mean that the President DESIGNS them!
    Perhaps a recommendation for an order was presented to him which he refused, but you have yet to prove that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
  18. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I could write a long, detailed answer about the current state of science, but I want to be brief.

    Yes, you can get infected a second time! This is more than just proven and proven multiple times. However, the second time almost always there seems to be no or only a minor course of the disease. The problem is that the immune system apparently after the first course of the disease a few weeks to months later ... let's say ... "disarms". However, if someone is infected again it remembers quickly and then reacts automatically with the appropriate antibodies.

    With a vaccination you get exactly the right antibodies for the body and the immune system without having to get sick. It is the basic principle as with any vaccination against any disease. So you can get infected again despite being vaccinated. Incidentally, this can also happen with any other illness such as flu. As I said, that's only briefly summarized. I could go deeper now, for example what concerns the B and T cells in the immune system, etc. ... but I'll skip that for now. But the point is also that the scientists themselves with Corona still have many question marks about all of this. And then don't forget: There is now the first mutation - this British variant of Corona too and it is not yet really clear what is here about vaccine etc.!
     
    chris155au likes this.
  19. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sure, but who was the head of this taskforce with the final decision to order? Trump!

    No ... but that the returnees were not put in general under quarantaine for 14 days as it has to be done!

    8QUOTE]So what do you suggest should have happened in the early stage? No exemptions whatsoever? A total travel ban where not even US citizens could have returned home?[/QUOTE]

    See answer above!

    Sure ... But who never got tired of saying He was the best and greatest expert on everything as always, eh? And who has all too often ignored the advice of the CDC and other experts ... just because He's the know-it-all, eh?

    See answer above ...

    Read the complete article please (the complete please!!!) ... and you see the theory and reality at least.

    There sould have been some sort of a quarantine as being told ... but nothing happened in reality ... Quote out of article:

    "In interviews, multiple travelers who arrived after the screening was expanded said they received only passing scrutiny, with minimal follow-up.

    “I was surprised at how lax the whole process was,” said Andrew Wu, 31, who landed at Los Angeles International Airport on a flight from Beijing on March 10. “The guy I spoke to read down a list of questions, and he didn’t seem interested in checking out anything.”

    Sabrina Fitch, 23, flew from China to Kennedy International Airport in New York on March 23. She and the 40 or so other passengers had their temperature taken twice while en route and were required to fill out forms about their travels and health, she said.
    “Besides looking at our passports, they didn’t question us like we normally are questioned,” said Ms. Fitch, who had been teaching English in China. “So it was kind of weird, because everyone expected the opposite, where you get a lot of questions. But once we filled out the little health form, no one really cared.”


    Question: Why were these people in March 2020 NOT PUT in quarantine?
    And who is responsible as commander in Chief for the depending services that they do their job at least? Why wasn't here any quarantine not even in question with them?
     
  20. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    What, it's in a bad state or something?
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2021
  21. Mandelus

    Mandelus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2015
    Messages:
    12,410
    Likes Received:
    2,689
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No ... but it will be a post long like a book with much Scientific jargon ;-)
     
  22. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Sure, but he knows precisely NOTHING about epidemiology and disease control. So he has to rely on experts. You DO realise that don't you?

    Yeah, now that you mention it, it does seem strange. A 14 day quarantine would have made sense, even though it would have been totally unenforceable unless it is done through a hotel quarantine operation like we do in Australia. But HOME quarantine? No guarantees that people will stay at home.

    That would be idiot Trump! Am I correct?

    I don't know who that is. People like to say that Trump ignored the advice of the CDC and other experts, but they can never back it up! That's no more valid than any conspiracy theory!

    This doesn't prove that a recommendation for an order was presented to Trump which he refused.

    Well again, you'd have to ask the CDC and other relevant agencies, as well as people like Anthony Fauci. and Deborah Birks. There could be a perfectly reasonable explanation that we're not thinking of.

    What do you mean, "depending services?"
     
  23. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2020
    Messages:
    7,707
    Likes Received:
    3,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    They don't really know how long the vaccine will be effective for and there have been cases where people who have had COVID contracted a second case so they recommend it even if you have had it as a precaution to reduce the risk of a second infection. Really no different than people getting a flu shot every year.
     
    chris155au likes this.
  24. chris155au

    chris155au Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2017
    Messages:
    41,176
    Likes Received:
    4,365
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Actually, the head of the taskforce was Pence at the beginning.
     
  25. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    May 15, 2017
    Messages:
    34,636
    Likes Received:
    11,205
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I would guess it might be a political stunt. Biden will be president very soon.
    It would force him to make the decision. That will then make Biden and the media look like hypocrites, because of everything they said when Trump put up the travel ban with China.
    It's basically tossing the ball to someone else. A hot potato that he knows will burn their hands.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2021

Share This Page