Could we Canadians STOP the Iran deal?

If....... Americans and Canadians will become well informed about the context and method by which President Abraham Lincoln saved American taxpayers FOUR BILLION DOLLARS in interest payments....... we will then know..... that it is theoretically possibly to give a high level of financing to projects like.....The Sahara Forest Project.... The Sahara Solar Breeder Project... .as well as Permaculture.

http://www.michaeljournal.org/lincolnkennedy.htm

A new sort of deal between Canada - Israel and Jordan...... in theory could be financed......... by Canada's Green Party..... for about five cents for every piece of paper..... !???????!

A one hour note.... costs about five cents to print up in a large volume and a one hundred hour note........ costs about five cents to print up in a large volume!

http://www.politicalforum.com/canad...008-campaign-my-apology-ms-elizabeth-may.html
Ignorance shown in my 2008 campaign, my apology to Ms. Elizabeth May!
Back in 2008 when I campaigned for the office of municipal councilor my ignorance regarding the importance of reducing atmospheric carbon is out there for all to see!

I am wondering if the information regarding the increasing acidity of the oceans can alter how we view the importance of altering our economy?

......
Ms. May…… a Green Party Volunteerism Hour somewhat like the Ithaca Hour or Green Party Volunteerism Dollars somewhat like Calgary Dollars could be initiated years before Canadians are ready to support carbon pricing.

Here is how I worded this idea over on the official Liberal Party Discussion forum:

IF the nations of Jordan and Israel............ ACCEPTED.......... a billion Green Party Volunteerism Hours....... then immediately........ they would have value...... and could play a significant role in increasing the volume of trade between our nations???

 

Actually......... even the act of seriously discussing the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third Temple............. sets in motion a series of events that have the potential to utterly transform the world economy....... especially if political leaders will learn what the phrase "ARTISTIC VALUE" means....... Most political leaders know what diplomatic value means..... and they know what educational value means....... and they sure do know what ECONOMIC VALUE means...... but they do not yet realize the potential artistic value even in ancient Jewish, Christian and Islamic scriptures!

(The down side to this artistic value..... is that ..... any proposal like this..... .could backfire and start WWIII.....?????.. So there is not only artistic value in these predictions..... there is also danger....... and most politicians don't want to discuss this. For the record..... Mr. Harun Yahya/ Adnan Oktar was nearly ten years ahead of Mr. Malik Obama in talking about this publicly)!

http://www.politicalforum.com/relig...mageddon-could-bring-world-out-recession.html
Artistic Hollywood style "Armageddon" could bring world out of recession?!

...A serious attempt to replicate "Armageddon" would create a minimum of two hundred million jobs in China, India, Russia and Mongolia alone....... not to mention the number of jobs this would generate in Israel and the surrounding nations.




Revelation 9:16


"And the number of the army of the horsemen were two hundred thousand thousand: and I heard the number of them."

China now holds so many American dollars that any possible way to cooperate at a higher level seems to be worthy of consideration.

One of the "stages" is the Jerusalem Third Temple complex. Without conflict a film is boring and we all know that lots of conflict surrounds the idea of rebuilding the Third Temple. Two logical years for this to happen are 2030 (only fifteen years in the future) and also 2070.

http://www.politicalforum.com/relig...ay-least-expensive-way-stabilize-climate.html

Rebuilding of Jerusalem Third Temple may be least expensive way to stabilize climate?

 

What held true from this article a few months back, holds true today. Same (*)(*)(*)(*) and stink from the GOP, different day.

 

Well said Wake_Up..... and I am not the only poster here on this forum who is attracted to the basic idea of greening the deserts as part of an attempt to stabilize the climate.


http://www.politicalforum.com/polit...mbatting-climate-change-unite-right-left.html
Could alternative method of combatting climate change unite right and left???

....Do you believe turning deserts green is part of a full response to climate change?Voters 12. You have already voted on this poll

Yes, plants are both a carbon and water sink! 5...............................................................41.67%

No, geo-engineering in any form is evil! 3.........................................................................25.00%

No, all effort must be put into a carbon tax or cap and trade system. 2............................16.67%

Yes, even religious people like the idea of producing food in deserts. 4...........................33.33%

 

Would you like to tell me PeppermintTwist..... the names of those G. O. P. officials who are advocating a massive program to turn the deserts of the nation of Jordan green?

For the record.... the Sahara Solar Forest Project..... is largely led by Norway.... and the Sahara Solar Breeder Foundation.... is largely led by Japan.


http://www.ssb-foundation.com
Sahara Solar Breeder Foundation

 

Strangely enough...... I would prefer to blame the whole thing...... on myself........... if the Helen Wambach Ph. D. research is tapping into something real......... then I probably really, really, really, really messed up..... over and over and over again over these past millennia............ so........... it is my fault!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But that alcoholic who takes responsibility for his part in his problem..... is the one who can often do the best job of making real changes.

http://tate4centralnova.yuku.com/topic/383/My-correspondence-with-Rabbi#.VbFAO2B1qOw

 

Actually............. being well informed about certain aspects of our history would tend to make any of us more than a little skeptical of our governments.

I believe that our political leaders are making major improvements over where they were at in the past....... especially the past of 150 year or so ago?!



https://www.facebook.com/notes/red-mans-view/how-lincolns-army-liberated-the-indians/515559085195891

What P. M. Stephen Harper did back in 2008 has had more value than we might tend to realize.



Prime Minister Harper offers full apology on behalf of Canadians for the Indian Residential Schools system - See more at: http://www.pm.gc.ca/eng/news/2008/0...dians-indian-residential#sthash.KshOMsFY.dpuf

 

It'll take lots more than a simple politically correct apology to repair the massive damage to our first nations because of that stupid white man policy that hurt so many.

Harper didn't follow it up with anything of substance to address the myriad problems faced by our first nations. An apology is one thing, better sanitation, better schools, better medical treatment, better financial management, better housing and adherence to the treaties are what actually makes a difference.

 

I am not happy with the Iran Deal myself especially releasing those Iranian Funds but I suppose this places the U.S.in a position that the world will see as GOING THE EXTRA MILE.

We will KNOW with 100% CERTAINTY within no more than 2 years if Iran will abide by this deal.

Two years is not going to make much of a difference as far as how many circa 1945 U.S. Military Design Gun Barrel Fission Bombs Iran could make as Iran right now has enough Weapons Grade Uranium to build 1 or 2 Fission Bombs with a nominal explosive yeild of between 5 to 7 Kilotons.

Iran really does not have any way to deliver these weapons except to place them on a flatbed truck and drive them to target or place them in a Passenger Jetliner and use it as a Suicide Delivery System.

Either way the U.S. has a very complex and detailed Radiation Detection System which would allow us to know if Iran was moving such weapons.

The U.S. Military is NOT going to be thwarted by a few of these old nukes so in the end either Iran abides by the deal....or the U.S. detects the radiation signature of such weapons being moved and we act.

AboveAlpha

 

This is somewhat reassuring information.......... This helps me to get a better idea of what the American negotiators were thinking..... and why........ but....... I can also understand why P. M. Netanyahu and a high percentage of Israelis ....... as well as a high percentage of people ...… (like myself)...… who are genuinely worried about the security of the nation of Israel.......... do not feel good about this deal....... in its present form???!

If....... P.M. Stephen Harper will figure out some way to slow this down.........… and force this to be edited at least somewhat............. He will certainly gain even more respect from those of us who basically agree with the way that he approaches Canadian - Israeli relations.

 

But.............. the magnitude of the cost involved with protecting the nation of Bangladesh alone............. to at least some degree offsets the probable cost of expanding The Sahara Forest Project, The Sahara Solar Breeder Project..... and potentially affiliated Permaculture projects that could operate within several kilometers of each of these large scale operations.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090205142132.htm

Collapse Of Antarctic Ice Sheet Would Likely Put Washington, D.C. Largely Underwater

http://education.nationalgeographic.com/encyclopedia/climate-refugee/

 

I thought Canada was just a big movie set auditioning aspirants for the next invisible man movie including his sidekick the profusely apologetic man.

 

Until we get an absolute guarantee, and observe the results that Iran, which was and is, seriously weakened by the economic sanctions imposed upon them by the Western Democracies to abandon their hostility toward Israel, their supplying and funding of terrorism in the Middle East, and full, unannounced access to inspect their nuclear program to insure they are not using it to develop nuclear weapons, than their $150 billion dollars needs to remain frozen. If true, they just put in a major order for Soviet refueling aircraft that extends their air force capacity to 7,200 miles - they are 1,200 miles from the Israeli border. Since the Iranian Revolution, the capture and holding of America's embassy hostages back under Carter, Iran has yet to demonstrate that they are reformed in any manner, shape or form, politically, militarily and religiously. Bill Clinton handed nuclear power and allowed North Korea to develop into a rogue nation and threat to every nation in SE Asia, and they sell weapons, missiles, even enriched uranium to anybody who wants to buy it. The only brake against them is China, and they are losing their grip on the North Koreans. Barrak Obama doing the same thing with a nation that not only is a mortal enemy of Israel, a nation that prior to 2008's Presidential election, was one of America's staunchest allies, and the only one in the region, but was spurned repeatedly by this President, supported by Hillary Clinton, who has an agenda that believes Islamic fundamentalist terrorism isn't a threat to the U.S., and that the Black community are the only American's he represent's as President, is committing us to a stupid and dangerous deal here, one that eventually will lead to war. Iran hasn't demonstrated any change in their ambitions in the Middle East since the Ayatollah in the 1970's, and there was, and isn't any reason to allow them access to the nuclear community of nations, because they will be the most hostile, unstable country, even more so than North Korea, with nukes. Unlike China, Russia, Pakistan and India, all with nuclear power, but nations which dislike each other intensely, and have fought several border wars against each other, and have religious and political differences, but maintain stability regarding nuclear weapons, Iran would be a rogue nuclear nation, committed to conquering and annexing ISIS, the IS and destruction of Israel. That will be the result of this treaty. I wonder, down the line, how many American "boots on the ground" will be returned in caskets to rid Iran of their terrorism and nuclear capacity, when all we had to do was keep the economic sanctions tight until they screamed. This is the Obama legacy - and it could mean nuclear war. We get nothing from Iran, any more than we get any concessions for the human right's violations and 50-years of fomenting revolution, particularly in Africa, by the Cuban government, as we re-establish relations with them also. The guy is just a cipher, his optics are unbelievably terrible, his appointments are mediocre, and his administration is a disgrace to every America, except Muslim's and Black's. We will be well rid of Mr. Obama, getting rid of Iran's terrorism will be much more difficult, unless Israel gets worried enough to do it themselves.............

 

.


- - - Updated - - -

The thing is because the United States was so busy looking at the BIG PICTURE during the Cold War we really screwed up in Iran.

We should have paid more attention to the repression the Shah was forcing upon the Iranian people as we could have done something about it.

But that has NOTHING to do with the FACT that Iran did not have the ability to build or design Nuclear Reactors so they signed the NPT and thus were allowed to purchase Nuclear Reactors and Nuclear Tech as they bought their reactors from Russia.

Iran has a right to enrich Uranium to Reactor Grade but not to weapons grade which is the only reason why Iran has built 17,000 centrifuges then in what I can only say to be THE MOST IDIOTIC THING IRAN COULD DO....Iran throws out all IAEA Inspectors...rips out all Digital Video Cameras which by the NPT treaty must be up and running 24/7 365 at all Iranian Nuclear Sites and then Iran secretly DIGS OUT SECRET UNDERGROUND BASES TO HIDE THEIR WEAPONS GRADE NUCLEAR ENRICHMENT PROGRAM.

The REALLY STUPID thing is anyone who worked in Iran's Nuclear Program KNEW that the U.S. Military has DEEP GROUND PENETRATING RADAR as NASA has been using such Radar in Interplanetary Probes for multiple decades.

Thus we found these secret underground Nuclear Facilities easily and quickly and Iran has admitted they built them.

So....we are giving Iran their last chance....and if Iran announces it has developed Nuclear Weapons....the U.S. Military will Invade Iran rather than allow Israel to bomb Iranian Nuclear sites thus poisoning the entire Middle East with Radioactive Dust.

AboveAlpha

 

Conservatives ALWAYS believe that war is a great solution. Hell, most of them want to go to war with Mexico over the Immigrant problem. After all it isn't THEM who'll be going and they can always pay for it by taking it from our infrastructure. American Patriotism can hold bridges up you know, and those who die in the collapses should be PROUD to give their lives in making America respected, (AKA, hated) by all the brown furriners in their benighted but freedom loving (*)(*)(*)(*)holes.

If we don't make a deal with Iran our gasoline will continue to go down, probably, not nearly as much as it will if we make the deal but still some, but if we go to war with Iran it will be $5 a gallon very quickly. The Sauds may not like the Iranians but their own people will not let them support the Great Satan if we're sending troops to the other major Islamic heartland, and it will very quickly escalate to that point.

War with Iran right now is literally insane. We have a real problem with ISIS and Iran is helping us there, HOW can we even consider basically going to war with what is becoming our best ally against our worst enemy? Hell, we'd probably be better off if Iran GOT the bomb, because they could use it against ISIS without provoking war with the entirety of the Islamic world.

We have been told that Iran was only a few months away from getting a bomb for about 15 years now. I am beginning to think our military and our conservatives have lied to us for their own gain (surprise, surprise) and Iran never really had a bomb after all.

Canadians, mind your own damned business, our conservatives have been pwning us very well all on their own for decades now, they don't need your help

 

We have gone not just the extra mile with Iran but the extra Marathon Distance with Iran.

We have done this because if Iran fails to honor the deal...we will be able to say we did what we could.

Hopefully Iran will honor the agreement but if Iran declares it has developed Nuclear Weapons and Iran has enough Weapons Grade Uranium to build at least one possibly two 5 to 7 Kiloton old Gun Barrel design Fission Bombs.......we will have no choice but to seize all Iranain Nuclear sites.

It's either we do it or Israel bombs them and poisons the region with radioactive dust.

So let's all HOPE that Iran is not stupid enough to think it can sign the NPT...violate every part of the NPT...and get away with it...because they can't.

AboveAlpha

 

AA, has anyone ever been into these secret sites and seen if they are (or were, or even could be) actually functioning as they are supposed to if they were making weapons grade uranium?

My contention has always been that Iran's nuclear program is pretty much a hoax. It's their response to our saber rattling and their way of paying off their military while keeping their power over a population that is known to be rather fractious. I think our conservatives and theirs are doing this whole thing as a put up job. Maybe it's not a real conspiracy but I think most of our and their conservatives know what is really going on and it's the same thing on either side

Also, why would Iran ever announce they had a bomb even if they developed one? Israel has well over 300 bombs that are known and the Iranian leadership doesn't want to die. (They USE suicide bombers, but they themselves are not suicidal. Political leaders send OTHERS to die, they never do it themselves, you probably know this better than most)

 

You can Google or run a search of the U.N.'s DOCUMENTATON OF THIS or you can look at the IAEA's....International Atomic Energy Agencies documentation of those secret underground Nuclear Facilities as IRAN ITSELF HAS ADMITTED THEY EXIST!!

Now I have a THEORY and I am not positive but with the knowledge, experience and people I know this THEORY of mine seems to make a lot of sense as I cannot understand why Iran would spend all the money and effort to dig out these Deep Underground Nuclear Uranium Enrichment Sites to hide their Weapons Grade Uranium Enrichment Program with those 17,000 Centrifuges and Iran has admitted that they have indeed built 17,000 centrifuges.

My THEORY is this.

Anyone of the Nuclear Scientists or Physicists that Iran has working for them as well as just about every ENGINEER of high quality would know as well that those DEEP UNDERGROUND NUCLEAR FACILITIES Iran dug out to house and use to secretly enrich Uranium above Reactor Grade WOULD BE DISCOVERED BY THE UNITED STATES USING BOTH SATELLITES AND RECON AIRCRAFT EQUIPPED WITH DEEP GROUND PENETRATING RADAR.

Any of these scientists, physicists and engineers would have to keep up with HIGH TECHNOLOGY DEVELOPMENTS and because NASA has been using Deep Ground Penetrating Radar for MULTIPLE DECADES I have come to this conclusion......

.....It would seem the BRIGHTEST AND BEST MINDS IN IRAN who are working in Iran's Nuclear Program to develop a Fission Bomb....ARE DOING EVERYTHING THEY CAN TO SLOW DOWN THE ABILITY FOR IRANAIN RELIGIOUS LEADERSHIP TO POSSES SUCH WEAPONS!!!

There is NO WAY IN HELL....these brilliant people were unaware of U.S. Deep Ground Penetrating Radar Capabilities.....NO WAY!!!!

The people who WOULD be unaware would be the Ayatollah's and Mullah's....and any Iranian Religious Leaders who basically wish Iran would live in the STONE AGE....as these Old Religious Iranian Revolutionary Guards....would be the one's who would have ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE....that the United States would easily find those Underground Nuclear Facilities.

So unless every single scientist, physicist, engineer...etc...in Iran is a COMPLETE MORON....which I do not believe for a second.....then it is THE BEST AND BRIGHTEST MINDS who are doing everything possible to slow down the Iranian Nuclear Program and thus slow down the ability for the Ayatollah's and Mullah's to be in possession of any large number of Fission Bombs.

AboveAlpha....continued

 

That is my THEORY and everything I know about this issue points to my Theory being correct.

Understand that Iran is using a U.S. Military Gun Barrel Fission Bomb design circa 1945 which is 70 YEAR OLD TECHNOLOGY which any KID going to MIT in Nuclear Engineering could make over a WEEKEND!!!

The DIFFICULT PART is obtaining or making WEAPONS GRADE URANIUM as Uranium Enrichment must be at least 90% and using Centrifuges is ANCIENT as far as Enrichment Technology as you only get a TINY AMOUNT of Weapons Grade Uranium from every Centrifuge and that is why Iran has built 17,000 of them and because Iran can purchase Reactor Grade Uranium at about 1/28 MILLIONTH THE COST PER POUND....it makes ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE TO BUILD SECRET UNDERGROUND FACILITIES AND BUILD AND RUN 17,000 CENTRIFUGES AS IRAN CLAIMS IT IS ENRICHING URANIUM TO REACTOR GRADE????

WHY WOULD ANYONE SPEND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO ENRICH URANUM TO REACTOR GRADE when Iran could legally purchase it at 28 Millionth the cost???

NO ONE WOULD DO THIS UNLESS....they were enriching Uranium to Weapons Grade.

AboveAlpha

 

Could we Canadians STOP the Iran deal?

Only if Canadians want to prove they care more about Israel's interests than world peace.

 

I admit that there are some positive things about this deal with Iran. I personally don't want to see those positive parts of the deal scrapped.

My impression is that there are some......... fairly serious errors in the plan....... and..... I have gotten the impression that Canada's Conservative Party, for all their flaws which are many, might just be able to do a surprisingly competent job of addressing those flaws, in such a way that the deal is modified in some important ways.

For example........... I don't really mind the fact that 150 billion dollars of Iran's own money be released to Iranians.......... if.......... the probability of Iran investing the bulk of that into terrorist activity, both in the Middle East as well as in many other parts of the world, is drastically decreased!

 

No...you are right.

There are some serious flaws in this deal.

But I can also see where such a deal that gives Iran what it wanted leaves no more room for Iranian excuses.

I mean...literally....this is it for Iran.

We gave them what they wanted and any failure to follow through with their end of the deal will result in a response by the U.S. both Militarily and Economically.

If they break the agreement....NO ONE is going to be supporting them in any way.

AboveAlpha

 

Although it is obvious that you are mostly being sarcastic........... this is actually an exceptionally insightful comment.

Hollywood has noticed............ that Hollywood........(and/ or Hollywood North)....... could well play a huge role in how future events work out. My daughter convinced me to watch both parts of The Hunger Games.......... and to at least some degree.......... we should all be aware that films can be used to alter how people think. There is both danger........ as well as great potential in this fact.

In a way..... I am advocating for P. M. Stephen Harper...... to play the role of the "bad cop" which will give President Obama and his more practical advisors, (who also are probably not totally enthused with the plan as it exists either)....... an opportunity to perhaps go back to the table...... and blame the fact that they have to do this on P. M. Stephen Harper......... and frankly....... P. M. Harper might well be more than willing to play that role?????!

 

But..... if ten to forty percent of Israeli citizens....... have an increased level of fear that could be quantified at ten to thirty percent magnitude.......... this is astonishingly dangerous for about ten million Iranian citizens.......... not necessarily for the Iranians who are actually at the table working on this deal.

I got the distinct impression that
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad
was quite willing to see the death of ten million Iranians........... if that would mean that he could be instrumental in the deaths of perhaps one million Israelis.

To what degree is the present Iranian leadership...... on basically the same page as he was????????????

 

Because appeasement worked so well with Hitler, Obama wants to try the same thing with Iran as well? Maybe if Obama spent more time studying history in school than toking up, he would remember this as well.

The American people don't want this deal. When the staunchest opponents of this deal are the people who live the closest to Iran (I.E. those who know Iran the best) you might have a problem.