“THIS IS DO-OR-DIE”: JOE BIDEN’S “ELECTABILITY” ARGUMENT IS HOW DEMOCRATS LOSE ELECTIONS

Interesting article that makes the case Biden is a guaranteed loser against Trump.


" Democrats fall in love, and Republicans fall in line. Since Vietnam, every time a Democrat has won the presidency, it’s because Democrats voted with their hearts in a primary and closed ranks around the candidate who inspired them, promising an obvious break from the past and an inspiring vision that blossomed in the general election. Jimmy Carter. Bill Clinton. Barack Obama. All were young outsiders who tethered their message to the culture of the time. When Democrats have picked nominees cautiously and strategically—falling in line—the results have been devastating, as Michael Dukakis, Al Gore, John Kerry and Hillary Clinton made plain. "


https://www.vanityfair.com/news/201...nt-is-how-democrats-lose-elections?verso=true

 

The Democrat Primary is the Old Guard vs the Democratic Socialist faction. The Old Guard still holds a lot of power but the times they are a changing. Not sure who will be the left's choice for President but it won't be Joe Biden.

 

Looks like the old guard is going to get Biden just like they got Hillary. Only question now is will the leftist show up at the polls or boycott the election altogether. Depends on how much hate for Trump the DNC and it's media can gin up. Hate is there only weapon.

 

Dukakis was calculated? How so? Al Gore was a fine candidate, he got more votes than Bush and Hillary got more votes than Trump. Clinton got elected because Perot. Bush got elected because of Nader siphoning of liberal votes from Gore in FL. And what does Vietnam as a point in time mean anything with political alignment.
It is pre civil rights/post civil rights. The south was a dixicrat stronghold until the civil rights movement. Vietnam did nothing to change the political landscape of this country - see afganistan, Iraq, Nicaruga, syria, Libya andassorted central american countries.

 

Post Vietnam was when the DNC started morphing into the socialist party it is today. Before that they were the loyal opposition not the America hating anti capitalist of today.
Every election cycle they younger generation of dnc voters get a little more radical left and now they are self avowed unabashed leftist. Getting them to the polls to vote for the old guard middle of the road old white guy will be a challenge and seeing Bernie once again sidelined will add fuel to the fire.

 

Huh- the dems of Kennedy/Johnson differed from the dems of 1933 by How? And the progressive wing of the dems today is a reaction to the reagan politics of the 80s. The breaking of unions, the discarding of defined pension plans, The worshipping of the military industrial complex. The stigmatizing of the poor. The glorification of greed.

 

This could be Biden's campaign song.

 

Sorry, but Vietnam changed a lot ... all the Anto War movements and protests forgotten, which divided the country at thsi time deeply?

 

Can gin up? As in dislike for him has to be fabricated?

 

I served in Nam, I remember America's feeling towards the war. But how did that change the political landscape?
Before Nam/Watergate America's attitude toward the government changed, no longer did America believe that it's leaders could be trusted to be honest. but caused no re-alignment politicaly. Look at the senate from 1952 to 2002. The south was all democrat and now it is all republican. VietNam did not cause shift,
Civil rights did.

But Are you trying to compare the protests against Nam as somehow even remotely similar to the civil rights protests and riots? The nation remembers 4 dead at Kent State a lot better than it remembers hundreds that died in Civil Rights riots in the 60s. I don't remember Vietnam protests burning down a dozen cities. The struggles of the Blacks to overcome government sponsored racism not just downsouth but in northern cities led to the political climate we have today than Nam ever did.

And you know that well known socialist Richard Nixon also proposed national health insurance- what a commie lover he was!

 

No, I do not make any comparisons or assessments, but also the civil rights movement, later from about 1968, the Black Movement (Black Panther for example) ... all this was interlinked and not really unique.

 

We are talking the nations political alignment. Vietnam did nothing to change this nation politically from then to now.
All the anti war protests did nothing that lasted the last 50 years. For 15 years it taught us a lesson not to involve ourselves in other nations political affairs. But since Iran-Contra It has been full steam ahead all over again. Can you imagine how the mideast would have changed if we sided with the people of Iran instead of the Shah and righted our wrong in overthrowing their elected government and placing the shah in as a puppet.

Iran with it's ancient hatred and distrust of russia Would have been a great ally in the 80s, and now in the middle east.

 

Daily by both the DNC and their media.

 

Kennedy would be summarily kicked out of today's democratic party which is embracing the Communism that Kennedy fought. The new democrats love Castro, Che and the boys.

 

Civil rights passed because of Republicans, democrats in congress fought it tooth and nail. The South's demographics have changed as people from northern states flee high taxes of blue states which is why the shift in voting in southern states. Unfortunately there liberals that flee mismanaged blue states and run to red States bring their blue politics with them

 

No one has to tell people that trump is not a person to be liked. He is an adulterer, a race baiter and a liar. I like his politics more than him as a person. I thought the country could never have a worse person than Bill Clinton as president, Trump is Bill to the 2nd ower.

 

You make my point for me. The democrats and their media call Trump a race baiter so you repeat it like a Parrott. As for adultery his was pre white house days and I remember when you leftist said Clinton's oral office adultery was nobody's business.

 

Yes, Republican help was critical to kennedy and Johnson passage of civil rights legislation. As I said in a previous post, Nixon even proposed national health insurance. Rockefeller republicans even voted for Johnson's war on poverty. Since then both parties have shifted to the right and this was pronounced very loudly with Dukakis and Clintion as candidate, both of who positioned themselves way to the right of the other dems they ran against.
Clinton brought us Nafta and an end to Glass-Segal. Oversaw a war on drugs that treated blacks far more harshly than whites. They even made cheap crack cocaine used by blacks more criminal than powder cocaine used by whites.

What we are seeing now is a return to FDR/Truman/Kennedy/Johnson/Humphrey democrats

 

As it was told by you ... Perhaps the most profound effect has been that the failure of the US in Vietnam has led the American people to question their government, politicians, and statements in a way that it has never done before. Since then, the US has been doubting itself and its role in the world. For the first time in history, the US had lost a war.
That has changed the nation long term to today.

Do you think that if 9/11 had happened at the end of the 1950's, US citizens would talk as much of a conspiracy and trust their own government and intelligence services rather than Islamist terrorists? Hardly ... and when did it start to happen that landing on the moon was called a fake by just a few Americans? Exactly!

And that goes even so far, that this ... for me as Foreigner ... completely ridiculous and led to vomiting guerrilla warfare of "lefty vs righty" in all respects as today and the country splits. That is only really in the USA since Vietnam and that's all "politics" too

For the rest full agreement!

 

and Trump is a race baiter. Not Black- but brown and arab/muslim. YOu think I need some stuffed shirt on TV telling me how I should think. I have ears and a brain to discern what is meant when couched behind a thinly veiled facade.

 

Embracing communist is returning to JFK how?

 

Examples of Trump race baiting would be?

 

Lol ... your comparison of Clinton and Trump here is like comparing apples and bananas! Completely wrong!

Clinton had sex with Monica, secretly, extramarital etc.... Evil for the shriveled moral apostles who say "Thanks God" 85 times a day and are actually total hypocrites as far as their great faith is concerned.
Of course a scandal and that he lied too ... but in principle the act was private in itself!

And Trump with Russia Gate? What is private about his connections and his people's connections with Russia, that he keeps the whole report under wraps? The only thing missing is that this idiot claims for the sake of the National Sichehreit, then he has completely turned into an idiot and horror clown.

 

Agreed Clinton affairs and Trump affairs are non comparable. Clinton promised us on sixty minutes those days were over as Hillary held his hand and smiled. Then he was elected and it was off to the races with Monica. Trump's affairs were pre presidency and that's between him and his wife.
The Mueller report found no Russian collusion so I have no idea what you are rambling about there.

 

I can say that my dislike for Trump came long before he descended that escalator. He was a self aggrandizing individual who boasted far too much about his wealth. One paying attention will always question an individual who boasts relentlessly about something - suspecting the opposite is likely true. But even if he was uber wealthy - why would any of us be necessarily impressed? Is money a measure of a person's character? Is it something we should all admire? He certainly thought so. One only needed to read The Art of the Deal to learn that he was not an individual worthy of admiration. His business strengths (as he deemed them) were not something to admire. And anyone paying even more attention were aware of his dubious dealings. And this was all before the ridiculous Apprentice reality show.

So for him to descend the escalator and announce his run was seen as a joke. Surely, America couldn't be that foolish. They couldn't possibly want for this kind of man to lead them. Could they? But we were wrong. Apparently a large number (though not the majority) decided that he was exactly the kind of person they wanted to lead them.

It was not the DNC or the media that stirred up the 'never Trump' movement - they did not form our opinions of him. It was his own words and actions that did it for those of us paying attention. We didn't need 'ginning up'.