Bye Bye Britain: The European Union's New Face A Commentary by Roland Nelles I personally am pretty certain that the UK will adopt the Euro too at the end of this decade or in the first half of the next one. There is no alternative!
I can't imagine what makes you so certain that the UK will ever join the euro when it means we give up the last remaining remnants of democratic control of our country. You shouldn't be so narrow minded as to think we have no alternative. German and French demands were outrageous. Robert Nelles sums up the federalist attitude beautifully in saying "arrogant posturing aimed at appeasing the electorate back home is damaging". In other words - ignore the electorate. That might be the kind of Europe you want Janpor, and good luck with it, but you'll never take the British willingly with you.
Best out come in 50 years is for the UK would be to set itself up as a Switzerland style financial haven, although I doubt the EZ will make it very easy for them. I'm personally don't really seeing how some rules and having to submit your budget plans really constitutes a proper fiscal union. For fiscal union you need a link between public spending in Portugal and the Germany tax payer. Unlocking the wealth of the rich to support the poor. Thats what the markets are looking for, to know those with the money are backing the weak links. All we have at the moment is a rule book and the potential for finger wagging. I wouldn't put too much weight in democracy people are stupid your average manon the street doesn't understand the crisis, has no concept of the world out side his little bubble. If worst thing you can do in crisis is let the ignorant have their say, we'll end up with the BNP building spitfires to invade the Faroes.
Well done David , He has the vast majority support vote of the population . Always best to put distance between yourself and losers . Now we can sit back , watch the losers slip down the plug hole and hope that not too much of their debt mess obscures our drive onwards and upwards .
I couldn't imagine anything worse for the UK, than encouraging a bunch of international tax dodgers to come and pretend to live in the UK, just so the UK (W/B)ankers can take their slice. The German model of manufacturing would be much more prefereable for the working / middle classes who want a freaking JOB!
I don't put too much weight in democracy now, but with the right government, one that's actually working in the interests of the population, I think the standards of the masses would rise. Even if they don't I still trust them far more than I do the present political class. There isn't really much evidence that they understand even basic economics, such a mess have they made of financial affairs.
Yes, there is, and I can assure you that the UK is not ever likely to become part of a massive European Super-State. That would be a disaster for the basic principles of democracy, since such a state could never be truly and properly democratic, run according to the will of its people in a way that actually reflects the interests and proprities of those people - the population are simply too diverse for that to be able to happen, and what would result would inevitably be an effective dictatorship by a wealthy and powerful self-serving elite, as we see in every other giant superstate across the world. If the rest of Europe if foolish enough to choose that route, then the UK will just not be going along for the ride - it's never, ever likely to happen (without an actual invasion!). The UK does not want to be 'separate from' or 'outside' Europe, at odds with our closest friends and allies - it would be a huge misunderstanding and mistake to believe that (although I'm sure some do think that is what the objections are about). The UK wants to be an active part of the European club, working closely on many issues with our trading partners, friends and allies. What is happening, though, is that others are changing the club rules (quite deliberately and knowingly) in a direction that the UK was never likely to be willing to go in. The UK isn't 'leaving the EU', but it looks like the EU is leaving the UK by gradually deciding to become one federal super-state. If that is the direction that the rest continue to go in, sadly the results will eventually be inevitable. The people of the UK will simply not accept such foolishness from their government, and the UK will not enter such a union, but seek to trade and work closely with it instead. It's not the way we want it, but the ridiculous and dangerous stupidity of going for full union into one great super-state, despite the warnings, will, if it continues, eventually leave the UK with no alternative. I am still hopeful, though, that the people of Europe will realise what their leaders are up to before it is too late, and their countries are no longer able to control their own destiny, but are under the control of a far distant elite government group who know and care nothing for the needs of the 'insignificant' people that no longer have any influence over policy or government at all. Things have changed alot over recent years. I used to think it could go either way, but I personally am now pretty certain that the UK will never, ever even adopt the Euro currency, let alone join a full political and/or fiscal union.
Cenydd, a pretty long post about nothing much really. Cameron -- to safeguard his bankers friends of The City -- sacrificed the well-being and welfare of the entire British populace. It never has been more clear! So I find it pretty strange you, and some others, are applauding this move. If everything goes well, and Scotland declares her independence in this decade -- we'll channel enough funds for the Scots to achieve that -- she'll join the EU in a heartbeat since their political leaders know full well that they can't copy-paste the socio-economic policies coming out of Westminster that are very English-centred.
Nope, not a vital part of the British economy. Sure, they generate a lot of percentage vis-à-vis the British GDP -- but I don't think they employ millions of people. Are you some sort of British embodiement of an American Republican that believes in a "trickle-down-economy". If so,... Social mobility in the UK is far lower than in most other European countries.
Janpoor , It is way past your bed time ,( are you 23 now or is that your next birth day ?) Off you go , and we can all have a nice long chat with you tomorrow when we speak with that nice Mister Jung .
Who are you to decide what's vital to the British economy? I don't think we'll be taking financial advice in this lifetime from someone who thinks we'll join the euro.
Respect for that excellent response . But consider taking your determined views over the water to the Land of Satanic Fatties . We are just a small island fighting to keep in the Premier Division . The bad guys are ---- the Devil's Children , I suppose .Fight them . ( They are a push over . Not the brightest)
UK has not played it's cards very well. At the very inception of the EU everyone could see where political and economic power was headed. Even the figure of British nationalism was pro-europe: "I wish to speak to you today about the tragedy of Europe. (...) Yet all the while there is a remedy which, if it were generally and spontaneously adopted by the great majority of people in many lands, would as if by a miracle transform the whole scene, and would in a few years make all Europe, or the greater part of it, as free and as happy as Switzerland is today. What is this sovereign remedy? It is to recreate the European Family, or as much of it as we can, and to provide it with a structure under which it can dwell in peace, in safety and in freedom. We must build a kind of United States of Europe. (...) The first step in the recreation of the European Family must be a partnership between France and Germany." Winston Churchill Speech at Zurich University 19th September 1946 The UK had two options: 1: Reserve political independence and loose global influence and control over its own economy. 2: Loose some political independence gain more global influence and control over it's own and other countries economies. From the 2 options the latter offers the UK more control and power. The first option which the UK has gone for means, yes more flexibility in managing the UK economy, but if the Euro-zone goes bad our efforts are pointless. Lets not forget that Spain has over 20% unemployment and in Scotland there are Spanish everywhere. I work with alot of medium and small businesses and they have told me of an influx on CVs from Spanish immigrants desperate for work. So the idea that the UK economy is independent of the EZ is pure fiction, problems in the Spanish economy are a problem for British workers. The veto by the UK means nothing except singling themselves out as trouble makers. In a time of crisis it's human nature to band together for survival, the UK has repeatedly turned it's back on Europe during the financial crisis, making many political enemies. The EZ will go ahead with its financial regulations and the UK will be powerless to stop it, its veto will now put the UK in a position were the EZ will deliberately work against them, viewing it as a competitor rather than an ally. Anyone who is still holding out for a collapse and fragmentation of the EZ don't under stand the impact of Globalisation on the world.
Oh yes we do . And it is precisely because of what you call globalisation , that the collapse is guaranteed . I think once you start to look at figures , instead of waffle , waffle , the light will dawn . If it does not , you have a most interesting storm heading your way .
Does Britain want to continue subsidising France and the Med countries ? To throw their money into supporting a currency they are not interested in joining ? To take up the slack because the Med countries peoples don't want to pay tax and want to take more out of Europe than they put in ? (THAT applies to France too) Its true that Cameron was more interested in protecting the greedy vermin of the City (who were a major cause of the economic meltdown to start with, and are the only ones NOT paying for their incompetence and risk taking) But most Brits would prefer to be out of Europe to be honest. Myself, Im neither for europe or against.
Many people take that view . It seems a simple answer that does not seem obviously nonsense and apparently "explains" a very complex global scenario . Yet these people are not branded criminals . In fact , the Government supported them every inch of the way and re capitalised or took some of them over .Banks , that is . The sector is fundamental for keeping the whole country alive and losing them is not even on the agenda So why would someone doing his job well deserve being called vermin? I am not a Banker . Neither do I work in the Financial Sector .
Can you paint me a picture of a orderly break up of the EZ? Bearing in mind the effects of currency depreciation and it's relation to existing debts. You seem to think the current leaders fools as if you have an easy answer, if so please put us straight....
