Christian Artists Could Be Fined, Jailed for Refusing to Make Same-Sex Wedding Invita

The constitution says absolutly nothing about states creating ordinances, the 1A specifically says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

I don't believe that limits the states at all from requiring business to equally serve all customers.
In no way shape or form does this prevent them from practicing their religion. If states were mandating a product then I would stand beside the business, or if they were required to operate on Sunday.


I would have no problem with an actual religious company that doesn't operate on Sunday, doesn't serve second marriages, doesn't serve any events that is forbidden in the Bible - unfortunately the only issue that violates anyone's beliefs is gay marriage - picking one group out of the thousands listed in the Bible is purely discrimination, especially when the group demanding the discrimination is themselves protected by state ordinances.

This same argument was used against blacks - it failed constitutional muster.

 

It isn't one person, it's everyone.
You are obsessed with gay men and gay sex - it's strange coming from someone that hates them (erm, "hates the sin lives the person").

It isn't limited to just posters either.

 

Got more strawman BS. I'm sure there are 100,000s of them.
How about a business person follow the law of the business license they applied for.

If the bigots also would hold the same view about those coming in for invitations that are on their 2nd or more marriage, they might have a religious leg to stand on. Instead they come of as hypocrites.
And so do those defending them.

 

Interesting because when have I said that I HATE those who have gay sex? Of course the answer is never.

Have I posted that I believe choosing gay-sex is part of a larger mental disorder as is evident by the depression and suicide rate of those who choose that lifestyle? Absolutely I have and also advocate for helping those with those issues. If a person is suicidal and also wants to engage in deviant as opposed to normal
sex then we as a society should help them. Patronizing those folks and acting like it's normal, is not helping.

Why are some people violent or others substance abusers? All, including choosing gay-sex can be treated but the person living the life must want the help.

 

Interesting. You feel that there is something wrong with them as human beings. Many like you push "Conversion Therapy" on kids in attempts to "pray away the gay", yet it only seems to drive up the suicide rate. Maybe you don't know what you are doing and should mind your own business. Maybe being gay is not what is causing them to feel unworthy of living. Hearing the words of the "holier than thou" telling them they are an abomination can take its toll over the years.

So feel free to believe that god created the universe in 7 days and that the sun was created on day 4! (How were there days before the sun???) it doesn't matter. Its written in a book and believing it makes you and your beliefs superior to others and you should decide who is worthy of freedom.

I think that there is nothing wrong with gay people and my reasoning is just as good as yours. (A burning bush told me so!)

 

studies (which have been posted in the niche subform on this site) show that the suicide rate among those living the gay lifestyle has no correlation to "bullying" as you try and imply. In fact, the studies reveal that those with suicidal tendencies have a higher degree of choosing gay-sex so that behavior would fall right into line with self-abusive behavior. If something is wrong where you already hate yourself then it makes sense to also engage in deviant sex.

Outreach and treatment is needed for those folks, not pandering.

And your false equivalnecy is not supported by any medical test. One chooses to engage in gay sex and can just as easily choose to stop. Since you chose to denigrate Christianity then I will factyally state that Christians do not hate people. A thief is only a thief as long as they steal and those who engage in gay sex can also change their ways.

 

Only California law requires business to equally serve all customers. Every other state with public accommodation law ONLY prohibits discrimination on the basis of a certain, select list of characteristics. UNEQUAL protection by design.

 

I completely agree, while I think any small independent owned and operated business that does not have monopolistic control of a good should be free to deny service to anyone they please, I cannot agree with pointing to only one group and saying your kind isn't welcome here. Either everyone should be reasonably accommodated or no one should be.

 

That's why I put the parentheses, you don't hate them - you just want to cure them of something that isn't an ailment. The depression, anxiety, and mental issues have been directly correlated to people like you and your passage aggressive ilk or worse. We don't want you help, we want you to f-off.

Homosexuality is a natural element of human sexuality seen since the dawn of civilization and in most animal species. It's as natural as your religious beliefs. A growing number of people believe your kind are the ones that need a cure.

 

I don't think government should involve itself with outreach and treatment of homosexuals but they definitely should get out of the business of pandering to the homosexuals so they can feel better about their homosexuality.

 

I am all too familiar with how conclusions are formed from “studies”. Homosexuals have only recently gained a level of acceptance from society allowing them to be comfortable with who they are. Saying that homosexuality is the cause of higher suicide rates is the same as saying that being male is the cause. Dig a little deeper and you will find out the root of their depression.

Did you hear about the study concluding that children raised to be happy and self-confident, have the lowest rates of depression and suicide?
If you have kids, they are well aware of how you feel about homosexuality. If any of your kids felt confused about their sexual identity, they would never open up to you knowing that you would think less of them. They would have to deal with their issues internally, without the benefit of professional help and will likely end up with permanent damage.

In conclusion, it is you who needs to change his ways. You can disagree and insist your beliefs are superior, but I will continue to point out the flaws and falsehoods you were indoctrinated into believing. How about the belief that penguins swam from Antarctica to get on an ark to avoid a flood! That’s a good one.

As wrong as I think you are, I should never enjoy legal protection for denying you employment, products or services based on your beliefs. It is just not right.

 

True.

It should be equality as per the constitution - not whatever weird idea you're talking about.

 

Should a person be able to deny a cake with a cross on it?
How about an atheist having to cater a religious event?

Why are you not vocal about anyone's ability to say f-off but Christians, who are actually - according to their own religious texts banned from shunning others. Do any of you people actually believe Christ would condone any of this?

James 2:1-26
My brothers, show no partiality as you hold the faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, and if you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “You sit here in a good place,” while you say to the poor man, “You stand over there,” or, “Sit down at my feet,” have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him? ...

1 John 4:20
If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen.

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

“I like your Christ;
I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

– Mahatma Gandhi​

 

To support your argument you provided:
An opinion
A youtube video
And an article whose contents you don't understand.

I'd ignore your posts except that it's so easy and fun to continue to let you embarrass yourself.

 

These public accommodation laws are UNEQUAL by design, only giving protections to certain, favored classifications. And they are unrelated to the constitution. ONLY the government is prohibited by the constitution from discriminating. A private baker discriminating doesn't offend the constitution

 

http://www.apa.org/monitor/feb02/newdata.aspx

Studies are finding that, although rates are slightly higher for depression and suicide, its unclear whether its due to homosexuality itself or to discrimination focused on homosexuals in our society.

Studies have shown that lesbian women's mental health is about the same as heterosexual women, and lesbians tend to have higher self-esteem. You guys never want to discuss lesbians, though.

Studies are also showing that while homosexuals may report higher rates of suicide attempts, after digging deeper into each case, about half of those reports are not attempts but rather thoughts of suicide.

I agree with you that if a person is suicidal, we should do everything we can to help them.

 

Sadly there are those who are beyond help no matter how much friends and family try to help. My family has lived through it and the guilt never goes away despite what "experts" tell family members after the fact. Suicide is not just a "gay thing" and as you learn more like we did, it's not outside influences which are the cause because the ticking time bomb is inside the person. We were not able to prevent it from detonating as our family member could not get out of the depressed state despite medical intervention.

 

Well, this is highly disputable, and the high rates of suicide among teens who are perpetually harassed and bullied do seem to indicate that outside influences can, at the very least, increase an individual's suicidal tendencies.

https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/bullying-suicide-translation-final-a.pdf

I'm sorry for your family's loss. I could never imagine having to go through such trauma with a loved one.

 

Boo Hoo I have to give minorities access to the same services, I give everyone else, even the ones I imagine having 'icky sex'. I need some media exposure so I can collect some 'charitable donations' from all the sheeple that know how to use Pay pal.

 

Brilliant deduction. It is simply amazing that that you are here to inform us that suicide isnt a "gay thing!" What ever would we do without your insight????
/sarcasm off


No (*)(*)(*)(*), dude. It is awesome that the light is finally on. Straight people get depressed and commit suicide. Imagine that. Mental disorders/depression dont think, "Hmmmmmm, i think i I will jump on him/her because he/she is gay." Furthermore, you believing being gay IS a mental disorder is YOUR issue not the gay community's. Why cant you simply stop worrying and obssessing about that which doesnt concern you? You have family and friends who are gay? Cool. Let. Them. Be!! You will be happier and, most imortantly, THEY will be happier. Even steven.

Im sorry for yalls loss...i know it sucks.

 

It's almost like these people want a civil war! Taking over America with their radical satanic ideas. I really don't think they want a civil war, but these kind of actions sure seems like it's going to lead to that. Complete indifferences on principalities and the discipline to uphold those principalities, to a point of complete hatred and anger towards one another. Just look at the protests/riots for Trump victory. The fact they don't like guns, is not going to help them. Kind of hard to win a war without them.

 

So much for the requirement if someone does business with the public then they cannot turn away someone they so not want to do business with.

If you don't like their belief.

No its not.

Yes it is.

You merely register for taxation and to identify the owner the government the government is not granting you the right to enegafe in commerece.

So the black sign and banner maker must great signs forbtheblical KKK rally.

So you assert a right to force them to violate their moral beliefs and force them to use their talents and skills to create something that violates those moral beliefs. A gay baker should be forced to create cakes and decorations ans the gay printer create the invitations and signs for a fundimentalist religious groups anti gay marriage meeting?

 

None of this is a criminal matter. Its civil court.

 

Yes if they believe doing so violates their moral beliefs.

Perhaps because I dont think people should speak to each other in that manner.

Who is "you people".

 

When you stop conflating this issue with issues of race and homosexuals and equating them to religious belief we can have a real discussion. As it stands you're simply constructing strawmen because you have absolutely no argument.

The OP is about a Christian business breaking state business laws.

It's not about the KKK, black bakers, muslim bakers, or homosexual bakers.

STOP conflating and creating straw men.