Christianity and our Nation.

I don't hate God
I hate what the idea of God has done to mankind
Right here on this forum we have people defending GENOCIDE because they believe that their "perfect God ordered it"
People willingly rejecting the greatest trait of humanity in service to a make believe entity.

Entire societies rejecting reason and logic, actually punishing those who engage in it.

Who knows how far we would have progressed right now if it hadn't been for regressive influence of those that believe there is a god

 

Did the thousands of children who have died as the result of Israel's actions bring "it on themselves"?
The civilians who had nothing to do with the attack, did they "bring it on themselves"?

How many Israeli civilians were killed or injured in the initial attack? About 1,400
How many Palastinians have been killed since then? Over 30,000 and of that 70% have been women and children.

 

I'd say that the reality of God is all that matters. God isn't an idea. Either he exists or he doesn't. If none of it matters, then your input is meaningless. The scriptures aren't a debate. They are a proclamation. So in faulting God you either lash at a phantom or lash at the giver and keeper of your life.

 

I don't care what Hamas reports. After their conduct on Oct 7th, only lies can crawl out of their mouths. All of the deaths on both sides are on Hamas.

 

I do not agree with this AT ALL.

Israel has made war on Gaza for decades without respite.

The methods of Israel's decades of war have been a constant attack on the lives of civilians. We see that clearly today, as the IDF teaches that all Palestinians are legitimate targets to kill. It is a call for genocide, starvation, destruction of civil infrastructures such as universities, water, fishing rights, hospitals and the act of being a DOCTOR. It's the slaughter of patients in hospitals, burred with intravenous tubes still attached - deep underground to hide their hideous crimes.

Netanyahu states that there will be no Palestinians remaining in Gaza. He has pointed to the new American port as useful in shipping Palestinians out of Gaza. He is the leader of the Likud party, which states that Gaza rightfully belongs to Israel.

The stalemate in creating a ceasefire is that Gaza demands that it be a step on the continuum to peaceful coexistence and autonomy while Israel sees it as a short interim before their "final solution" as taught them by the Holocaust.

 

We are a religiously plural nation.

I don't fault god. I fault the idea that your god is the only and absolute truth.

 

For the first twenty six years of my life I lived a secular existence. I never found talk of God to have any negative impact on me. I simply ignored it and went about my life. Come to think of it, believers were actually fairly decent people as people go. So I can't relate to your animus about God or religion, especially a record of a battle that happened four thousand years ago. It has no impact on anyone.

 

Speaking for myself, I wouldn't worship a God who isn't the one true God. I am reconciled to that. And I think that reason would support the concept of one true God if God is the most high. That said, you are free to believe what you want for the cause of religious plurality, and I support that right because it is also my right.

 

I don't carry animus about you practicing your religion.

But, surely Joshua's genocide DOES have impact on us today, as it demonstrates that your god is willing to support genocide in the aid of his chosen followers to steal the lands of other people. There is no way around that fact of the act of God and Joshua. And, it applies directly to current events where the USA and Israel use genocide on Palestinians as Likud calls for ownership of Palestinian lands as a birthright.

Once you believe this aspect of your god, it can not help but blunt your concern for the lives of those standing in the way of Zionism.

 

We take refugees. In fact, our borders are open to the world for any reason. Why do you suppose Jordan Saudi Arabia and Egypt don't want anything to do with Palestinians as refugees?

 

What's your point?

A major part of America HATES refugees.

Egypt already has more refugees from various places than they are prepared to deal with.

Besides that, being a refuge is horrible. It's the abandonment of ones homeland and all one has owned. It's the abandonment of ones society, family, the graves of ancestors.

Turning people into refugees is an atrocity.

 

It has impact TODAY
Those who believe the stories of the Bible use that belief to justify the most immoral things.

 

The question shouldn’t be why aren’t these countries taking in refugees but why are these people refugees to begin with.

 

No, that is a different question. You won't answer mine. If the world was concerned for their safety, they would take them in until Hamas is destroyed. Thing is, Palestinians and Hamas are one and the same.

 

Harboring terrorists is an atrocity. Putting terrorists in power is an atrocity. Where do you get the idea America hates refugees? A better idea would be that you hate America! Illegals are coming here for economic opportunity illegally. Refugee status is just an excuse. We have legal refugees from South Viet Nam, Afghanistan,Ukraine as well as other countries.

You sure don't show much concern about American hostages. You play right into their narrative.

If Palestinians were concerned about us getting back our hostages, (which is the opposite of refuggees) they could deny their shield status, temporary leave the area until Hamas is destroyed. Fact is, they put Hamas in power.

 

That isn't reality. First off and not to split hairs, but God isn't my God as if I owned him. In truth, I am his because he has claimed me and freed me from the spirit of the oppressor.

Second, the God of the Jews isn't an idea cooked up by Jews to justify their behavior over thousands of years. Were it so, then most of the scripture wouldn't testify against them of their sins and the dire straits in which they often found themselves because of their disobedience, such as being enslaved and so forth. So it is odd that you see it as self serving and cannot see the hand of God in it or the rightness of his commands which you deem genocidal and thievish.

Third, there is no genocide in Gaza. Israel possesses the might to do so, but it never has. On the contrary, Israel's enemies try with all their might to annihilate Israel, without warning and without provocation. If in so doing, they provoke Israel's wrath out of necessity, then it is justice. If you pull the tigers tail, you get the tiger. If you don't want the tiger, don't pull his tail. Gaza isn't an innocent child.

Breaking into Israel, without provocation or warning, and mercilessly slaughtering twelve hundred innocent Israeli's in their religious leisure, and taking 300 hostages back to your holes is not an act of playful innocence or self defense. It is devious, cruel, and foundationless. But if you wish to justify it, then Gaza has pulled it down on themselves, and justice is unfolding as the IDF rolls thru Gaza, ferreting out Hamas. Being a Palestinian doesn't absolve you of the consequences of your choices and behavior. You can't dish out terror and teers, and then be astonished if it's served back to you.

 

We know why the IDF is in Gaza. It isn't biblical. Which Bible story did Hamas use to justify Oct. 7th?

 

The military forces defending Gaza have been defending Gaza against Israel's siege that Gaza has faced for the last decades.

That is full time Israeli war for more years than the average age of citizens of Gaza. For most Gazans, they have never known a time when Israel wasn't making war on them.

You claims rights of punishment of a people, but there is NOTHING legal or legitimate about that.

Today, Israel is committing genocide. There is no higher crime.

There are NO SHIELDS in Gaza. The IDF is willing to kill anyone they see. The starvation they use as a method of war has no shield. The IDF has NO idea where any possible living hostages are, and thus those hostages have no shield value.

Israel has drones that broadcast realistic pleas for help. When Palestinians come to help, they are killed. THAT is how far Israel has fallen.


The time of Israel's siege is over - after DECADES. Israel is left slaughtering citizens in a mass genocide - which nobody on Earth will support.

And, the IDF has not made progress against the various groups defending Gaza.

 

Sure it's Biblical. Israel thinks that the land is theirs because it was "promised by God"
That means any defense of the land is justified to them.

 

I'm quite familiar with your view on that. But, the central point is that there are other views.

The Bible states that God helped Joshua slaughter the men, women and children of Jericho.

That was not a punishment of the Israelites. It WAS genocidal. And, the purpose was to take their land by force. After Moses died, God allowed the Israelites to enter the land promised to them by God, under the leadership of Joshua.

How is this not like what Israel is doing today? The Likud party believes God has given them the land that Palestinians are living on. All that is necessary is for them to take it.

This is an absolutely ABSURD story line.

Israel has laid siege to Gaza for DECADES. That is war. And, today they are slaughtering tens of thousands of civilians in what has been recognized by the world community as genocide.

Gaza watched and learned from West Bank. The attempts of a negotiated solution, involvement of the UN, the policy of non-violence and cooperation with the IDF and the strong opposition of the US have been a MASSIVE failure.

It resulted in no more than the US defense of Israel's theft of property owned and lived on by Palestinians while Israel governs Palestinians land with their military law in which Palestinians have NO REPRESENTATION.

America was BORN of our just demand for representation.

With West Bank as the example of US involvement and the total failure of attempts at peaceful resolution, what direction was left for Gaza but to fight the decades long siege of Israel?

 

The Jewish disobedience was turning away from God.
It wasn't that they killed too many people.
In fact Saul was punished and removed as King of Israel because he DIDN'T kill everyone.

 

Of course I wasn't there for the decision.

But, the Oct. 7th action put the problem of the Israeli war on Gaza front and center again.

For many years, the war Israel has waged against Gaza has been below the radar of international issues.

Now, it is recognized as a serious issue.

Was there some other way that Gaza could have achieved that focus from the US, UN, ICJ, Israel, the world community of nations?

I don't believe so.

West Bank attempted strictly peaceful approaches through President Abbas and his achievement of "Observer Nation" status in the UN.

But, that has proven peaceful methods to be no more than encouraging of Israel's colonization of their land - as defended by the US.

 

Children are Hamas?
Women are Hamas?
Aid workers are Hamas?
Hospital patients are Hamas?

 

I would like to see some objective truth to that claim.

I would like to see objective truth to that claim. Israel has never known a time where Palestinians have not called for their annihilation worldwide. They are unashamedly vocal about that.

I have never claimed punishment. Whoever is in the way of getting to Hamas has a problem....that's all.

This is a lie. A flat out lie. Are you seeing Israeli's attacking and Killing Palestinians within their own borders? Palestinians that are not a threat?

Jerusalem is a place where both Christians and Muslims worship. They are free to do so. Muslims are the only ones that declare "death to the infidels". Much of the leadership in Israel is completely secular.

I have responded to two here, that are pro-Palestinian. At the same time, I would bet the farm, they are also pro-LBGTQP. It would be a fair statement that the only thing these two factions have in common is they both hate America. We saw this same movement among SDS in the late 60's early seventies including the like of Jane Fonda that aided and abetted North Vietnamese Communists while spitting on American POW's.(figurally speaking). So we are watching these motives develop. We do know George Soros is providing the funds for tents and organization on American campuses that openly declare "death to Israel" and "death to America". It is either because he envisions consolidated global power or just a form of "cultural Marxism". That is not clear to me but the hate for the American form of Republican Democracy is really clear!

 

Women and children have been indoctrinated to believe Jews are dogs. Yes women children and babies. We have seen the indoctrination films. That does not mean they all deserve to be targets, but leadership has been put in charge of them and unfortunately they often become collateral damage. Their leadership is 100% responsible for that. I believe you know that. Immediately after Oct. 7th it was acknowledged the propaganda plan long term, would by for the likes of you, Willreadmore, University students, and others to stand in the way of eradicating Hamas and freeing the hostages. You are working for those ends.