Creationism in schools

Well, there are some Atheists who are homosexual or lesbian or gay (whatever the proper title is) so I guess that places all Atheists in the same category(ies).

What is 'apparent' about the sun? Certainly not its' movement. Or are you one of those ancients who believes that the sun revolves around the earth?

 

The difference between Akhlut and your statement is Akhlut is using the word ALL:

While you used the term some:

So Akhlut assertion that ALL versions of American Christianity that include Santa originate from Europe. Thus, all Christians are liars. is correct.

However, yours in not, Just because SOME atheist are part of the LGBT community, that does not mean ALL atheists are. An incorrect assumption on your part.

 

Well, your logic certainly damns all Christians, as you extrapolated a dogma of sun worshipers to be modern dogma of science, so old traits of Christians (or even just religious people, I suppose would also work) would apply to all modern Christians.

Or, more probably, your logic is based on faulty premises and non sequitors. I'm going to guess the latter is far more probable.

For someone so hung up on semantics games, you certainly are not aware of the meaning of words.

"Apparent" here being used in the sense of "appearing as actual to the eye or mind" or "manifest to the senses or mind as real or true on the basis of evidence that may or may not be factually valid" or "according to appearances, initial evidence, incomplete results, etc.; ostensible rather than actual", synonymous with the words "ostensible", "seeming", and "supposed", all of which do not have the connotation of being factually correct.

Furthermore, the sun does move, though the earth is in orbit around the sun, the sun is in orbit around the supermassive black hole in the center of the galaxy.

 

Of course they are observing the sun rose and set, but they also add an additional attribute to the observation: that the sun they are observing is a God. Of course believing that the sun is a God worthy of worship is a dogma, but that isn't what I asked. Is the observation that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west and SOLELY THAT observation a dogma?

 

Without a (conscious) observer, things don't exist at all, except as calculated probability waves.

 

And your point is what? He plainly stated that all Christians are liars, in spite of the fact that he cannot prove that all Christians practice the worship of Christmas. I for one do not practice Christmas. I accept it as a holiday wherein a lot of people practice that tradition, but I do not acknowledge it as being Biblical and therefore do not practice Christmas.

Yes! I used the term some and therefore I was more accurate.

And as I said, not all Christians practice Christmas. Therefore Akhlut and you are in error.

Try again, once you correct your first and foremost egregious error. That of assuming that all Christians practice Christmas.

 

When you acknowledge that rising and setting, and make a statement toward that event, you form a dogma. Especially when you say that the rising and setting of the sun occurs with the rising in the east and the setting in the west and you believe that to be an absolute truth.
"2. An authoritative principle, belief, or statement of ideas or opinion, especially one considered to be absolutely true. "

Now do you believe that the sun rising in the east and setting in the west to be absolutely true?

 

I wouldnt mind seeing religions being taught in school, as long as it isnt used as indoctrination but more in a way of a study on different religious view points. I dont think it should be a required class by any means, but like a side class like music or art.

I dont see any wrong in the study of theology, but again as a form of study and not recruitment or indoctrination. Knowledge is power ultimately.

 

Nobody is saying that it is an absolute truth, stop trying to create strawman arguments. Is the simple observation that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west and SOLELY that observation (do you know what solely means?) a dogma? Why can't you answer that simple question without tacking on conditions to it? Did I mention absolute truth? Did I mention making statements about the observation?

 

Psst, using this definition exclusively renders the word "dogma" essentially meaningless, as that describes the whole corpus of human thought that is not explicitly fictional. Math? Dogma. The idea that observed facts are observed facts? Dogma. Inductive logic? Dogma. Deductive logic? Dogma. Logic in any form? Dogma. Having thoughts on how the universe works in part or in whole? Dogma. Oh, hey, the word is then reduced to absolute worthlessness as a description or even as the pejorative you are intending it to be because it describes absolutely every human concept that isn't explicit fiction.

 

Irrelevant to the discussion. Mine is a comparison ... you know ..tit for tat. . You without proof... condemn all Christians... I with equal evidence condemn all Atheists.

Yours is definitely faulty premises.

I guess that would depend on which dictionary one is using. Just because you chose to use a different dictionary than the one I use, means little.

ap·par·ent (-prnt, -pâr-)
adj.
1. Readily seen; visible.
2. Readily understood; clear or obvious.
3. Appearing as such but not necessarily so; seeming:

Ah, but the suns movement is not visible to the senses. Only through the use of specialized equipment. Your rendition of the suns movement is disqualified by the very definitions you supplied above.

 

In other words, you are unable to adequately refute the reality of that definition. BTW: You don't have the authority to render that definition meaningless. It is what it is.

 

Red Herring, what you are/do is completely irrelevant to Akhlut's use of the word 'All' vs your use of the term 'some', This is typical of your 'debating' style. Toss in red herrings to confuse the issue.

And no, Akhlut never said christians were all liars. He was simply stating that christians are liars as a consequence of All versions of American Christianity that include Santa originating from Europe.

For someone who plays a lot of schematic games, it sure is funny you do not see this.

Hardly, you lumped all Atheists as part of the LGBT community. That is an incorrect assertion.

Because of this, your assertion of “I was more accurate” is also incorrect.

Red herring alert! This has nothing to do with the the use of 'some' vs 'all'

Red herring alert! This has nothing to do with the the use of 'some' vs 'all'

 

Why can't you answer the simple question "Do you believe that the sun rising in the east and setting in the west to be absolutely true?"

 

It only appears so. The earth spinning is what causes that appearance. Relative to earth (and ignoring for simplicity the fact that the earths orbit is not a perfect circle), the sun does not move, though it is, itself, orbiting the center of the galaxy. It takes about 240 million years to complete one circuit, which means the last time it was where it is now the dinosaurs weren't here yet.

 

This is a loaded question only fools would answer.

Absolutely

In 5 billion years the sun will become a red giant. When this event occurs, the sun may expand far enough to reach Earth and engulf the planet. At this point the sun will defiantly NOT rise in the east and set in the west.

But as I go to sleep tonight, yes the sun will rise in the east and set in the west.

This is pretty simple. Why cant you grasp this?

 

"All versions of American Christianity that include Santa originate from Europe. Thus, all Christians are liars. "

A sentence with a complete thought. He called all Christians liars. Whether or not you like it.

 

Consequence

Point out a consequence is not the same as calling a group something.

 

Then why did you keep harping on about the long-dead sun worshipers when it was clearly evident they had no bearing on the conversation?

HAHAHAHAHAHA! Oh, my, I can't believe you are trying to make this argument.

YOUR OWN DEFINITION YOU INCLUDE VINDICATES MY WORD USAGE!

"Appearing as such but not necessarily so; seeming" with regards to its motion across the sky, with the sun rising in the east and setting in the west.

Well, firstly, you're using an English language dictionary, which is descriptive, not prescriptive. English dictionaries merely describe how words are used and are generally agreed how they are used; they do not prescribe how to use said words (hence, how the noun "experience" became a verb).

English usage has no authority within it at all, unlike Spanish or French, with their language academies. Hence the common usage of foreign loan words, uneven application of linguistic rules, tendency to create novel words with NO antecedents in either foreign languages or English (grok, jabberwocky, grinch) and so on.

Of course, even if one were to accept your usage as totally correct, that doesn't mean that scientific dogma (in relation to usage of the scientific method) is equivalent to religious dogma. After all, science works very well (that's why you can use a computer, can rely on most medicines to work fairly effectively, and can survive car crashes in modern cars), religion, not so much (rabbits don't chew their cud, clouds aren't formed from the brain material of a primordial frost giant from Scandinavia, and the earth wasn't formed from the body of a primordial crocodile slain by a heroic deity from central Mexico).

 

You never asked that question. I already said that nobody is saying it is absolute truth. Now answer my question which you have refused to do without adding conditions to it.

 

Then attempt to deny that it is a guilt by association fallacy.
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/guilt-by-association.html

 

Because there are still sun worshipers today. No stay on topic.

 

http://www.politicalforum.com/religion-philosophy/202355-creationism-schools-74.html#post1062294864

Now tell another lie.

 

WTF does who I like or do not like have to do with demonstrating a consequence vs calling a group something?

This is beyond a red herring. This nonsensical.

 

Oops sorry, I missed that final line! I wasn't lying, just didn't see it. But I did under answer it.