EU - USSR Comparison ... .

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by spt5, Jan 17, 2012.

  1. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    The EU is trying to create a union by establishing a Germany-France core alliance with all other countries as satellites to it.

    The USSR built a union that eliminated all borders inside it, provided a single language administration (russian) to all its members, and constructed a new unified identity called "the Soviet man".

    The EU doesn't aim to achieve the above Soviet results. It is no surprise then that it is only the former Soviet republics that don't seek escalating conflicts between themselves in Europe.

    What is the purpose of the EU if it doesn't want to provide the 3 basic things a union needs, such as no internal borders, unified language admin, and a union identity? Especially that the USSR has already achieved all this a 100 years ago?
     
  2. tamora

    tamora New Member

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    How do you know what the EU wants to achieve? Do any of us? The purpose of the EU is to further multinationals' interests and those of its own servants as far as I can tell.
     
  3. SiliconMagician

    SiliconMagician Banned

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    LMAO

    "oooohhh noooozz doze evil capitalistz want to conquer uzzzz"

    Corporations can't take your freedom from you, only Government bureaucrats can do that. I don't see corporations wiping out Democracy across the EU, only Eurocrats.
     
  4. tamora

    tamora New Member

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    I didn't say corporations could do anything.
     
  5. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    But don't those corporations (banksters/insurancesters) buy up the EU's bureaucrats as well as its legislative branch? That way they make cutting your throat possible. And even if they don't, wouldn't you start up a similar "corporation" for your own grounds if you were a bureaucrat even without external business/political interference?

    But I think they do. Your IRA/401k for the past 40 years volumed them up to the level that they even (legally) poison you. Who wants to be fat like Americans?

    This is absolutely true, but this didn't start with the EU. It grew out of proportion as early as 1920, see the map of Europe today. Isn't the Soviet Union a better alternative then? At least it didn't strive on generating internal conflicts for exploitation, and its "multinationals" equalized each constituent group instead of differentiating them.
     
  6. Flag

    Flag New Member

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    The EU leaders cant even wish to build something as great as Lenin did.
     
  7. janpor

    janpor Well-Known Member

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    :laughing:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6DQMY2ZaNU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6DQMY2ZaNU[/ame]
     
  8. janpor

    janpor Well-Known Member

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    Had to wait 5 years on new furniture...

    Meanwhile you had to sit on the ground, I suppose.

    The SU only serves as a model on how not to implement socialism.
     
  9. janpor

    janpor Well-Known Member

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    :bored:

    Do try to keep up...

    This has always, at least from 1945, has been the case. Before you had almost an entire millennium of constant struggle.

    You learn this in high school.

    The question now remains: where did you went to school?
     
  10. Flag

    Flag New Member

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    Lenin and Stalin lived more than 50 years ago, that video and traitor gorbatchev are from the 80's
     
  11. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    If this is something like reestablishing the Frankish Empire (as your quotes suggest), then where does this leave the new EU member states, all of which lie outside the historic borders of that historic Frankish empire? Satellite states, like I suggested?

    And the historic Frankish Empire had a single official administrative language, Latin. This new modern Frankish Empire has as many administrative languages as countries in it. Every real empire in history tries to unify people's identities starting with enforcing a single state administration language. The EU is not on this path, despite your quotes.

    What is more apparent is that all countries around Germany+France are slowly becoming internal colonial outposts. And the new EU will just be a Germany+France, not a real union.
     
  12. tamora

    tamora New Member

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    I thought you were joking, or playing devil's advocate, but you asked if the Soviet Union is a better alternative in all seriousness it seems. No, the Soviet Union is not a better alternative. I want democratic government in the UK and that means leaving the European Union - nothing less will do. Democracy is in no way ideal, but it beats any other system that's been tried. The SU wasn't even on nodding terms with it. Who wants to murdered or starved to death in their millions like Russians?
     
  13. janpor

    janpor Well-Known Member

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    Nobody is talking about re-establish the Frankish Empire.

    My quote ought to be seen in the light of "Franco-German Friendship" nowadays, re-installed, after basically a millennium of hostilities.

    The Franco-German Friendship is deeply rooted, and is not something "new" as you seem to suggest. All I'm saying.

    Out of this Franco-German flower stalk, a great flower with magnificent petals was able to grow. I hope you get the analogy...
     
  14. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    How is democracy more than a propaganda tool? Aren't the laws of the UK (and all other democratic countries) written by financial institutions that elected politicians could and will never control?

    In this respect, the Soviet system was better, there was no pretence in it, and at least it reduced most group conflicts within its geography. Why do you use the word "democracy"?
     
  15. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    This would be nice indeed. But recent facts seem to show that the Franco-German Friendship is doing the opposite of this. Look how it strengthens internal borders in order to discriminate between EU members. My bet is that the Franco-German Friendship is only a competitive alliance to manipulate the internal EU environment to worsen the conditions of other EU members, especially of the East Europe / Balkans.
     
  16. tamora

    tamora New Member

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    Democracy is not a propaganda tool, though the forces which influence public opinion are. Like I said, democracy isn’t perfect ... it depends too much on an inquiring electorate, a free press and honest politicians, none of which we have. Despite that it is superior to anything else that’s been tried because the people still, even now, have the power to change the direction of the government. As a consequence we have politicians spinning furiously for votes and then disappointing their supporters when in office.

    There was no pretence in the Soviet system? What was Pravda all about then? Or the denials that millions died? And as for its being better, tell that to the population who lived in fear of the secret police, or those who simply stood in line for hours in food queues. Probably the best thing I could say about it is that Soviet workers got their heating thrown in with the rent on their sad little apartments. I want a lot more from any system I live under than reducing group conflicts.

    I use the word ‘democracy’ because I want a government which genuinely respects the will of the people. It’s odd that you argue the merits of the Soviet system whilst living in Monaco. It must be the ultimate in do-as-I-say-but-not-as-I-do preachings!
     
  17. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    You give the appearance of either not having travelled a great deal , and/or , being remarkably selective in what you claim you see .
    But , if you are happy and content living in the Federation , so be it . Good luck . Particularly as I expect it not to be around much longer in its present form .
     
  18. Hugilanim

    Hugilanim Banned

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    The EU and the USSR is not correct to compare.

    The Soviet Union is a continuation of the Russian Empire - Russian civilization, uniting many nations with a common mindset in a centralized country.

    The EU is stillborn education created financial-industrial groups in Germany and France to use the smaller countries of Europe as a market for the elimination of industry and to bring these countries out of Russia's influence.

    Unlike the Soviet Union in the EU developed the industry including the territory of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia, which is now effectively a regime of apartheid, the industry is destroyed and the population has left to work in Western Europe.
     
  19. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    I am sure the historical differences are self evident to everybody here . But that in no way stops a comparison .A contrast between my speed over 100 metres versus Mister Bolt is clearly absurd in terms of useful follow up action , but it is quite valid . We are not on the same planet in this one area but it is a simple fact that he runs faster -- even though this fact achieves nothing , apart from the blindingly obvious --- that he will represent Jamaica in London . I will not even represent the street where I live .
    And in lay person terms , this Topic boils down to , which State is more prosperous , replete with opportunities , less corrupt and operates by the Rule of Law and pays literal respect to Freedom of Speech .
    For anybody who has travelled widely in both the EU and the Federation , the question is a no brainer and -- with genuine respect --- laughable .
    However , for people born and raised in the Federation , other important factors apply and are all important to them .
    It is much more important that people from both sides should visit and mix and work with common goals and in friendship and genuine respect .
     
  20. morfeo

    morfeo New Member

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    In the SU there was eguality among several republic, the EU is like a IV Rech when the german decide and the other members obey.
     
  21. janpor

    janpor Well-Known Member

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    ...

    Don't act so clueless, and don't post such insulting garbage, my friend.

    Or do you need reminding that Italy basically formed a monolith with Nazi-Germany, and thus, was an inherent and inclusive part of the "Drittes Reich"?

    Truth is, that it is not Germany calling the shots, but Anglo-American financial imperialism:

     
  22. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    This is true, but don't you think that the European people themselves put themselves out for it?
     
  23. spt5

    spt5 New Member

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    What am I missing, that is not just propaganda, or a reduced standard of living that we all are speeding towards?

    Why are you saying this? (Interesting.)
     
  24. Pyokva

    Pyokva New Member

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    I agree! But then Stalin came and completely ruined the USSR!
     
  25. raymondo

    raymondo Banned

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    Why did you stop there?
    Every so called leader since , with the exception of Gorby , has had the dedicated mission of dragging Russia further and further down and moulding it's inhabitants to Serf status .
    You watch Vlad the Bad thrash them after the election for daring to speak without being asked to ?
    Bloody peasants . Give them Bread and they want more .
     

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