Faith and doubt

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by montra, May 13, 2012.

  1. montra

    montra New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2011
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    0
    There is no faith without doubt, much like their is no courage without fear.

    Discuss!!
     
  2. Catenaccio

    Catenaccio Banned

    Joined:
    May 12, 2012
    Messages:
    670
    Likes Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    0
    There is no faith, without ignorance.
     
  3. montra

    montra New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2011
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Unfortunatly, we all have ignorance because it's part of the human condition, except for me, of course. Fortunatly for you kids, I'm all knowing. :)
     
  4. Catenaccio

    Catenaccio Banned

    Joined:
    May 12, 2012
    Messages:
    670
    Likes Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Very reassuring!
     
  5. montra

    montra New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2011
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Isn't it?

    I would say that doubt can cripple you from acting or such doubt can be overcome through faith. There is no middle ground.
     
  6. stig42

    stig42 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2012
    Messages:
    5,237
    Likes Received:
    33
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Unproven certainty is faith without doubt


    it may take more courage to have faith with doubts though
     
  7. montra

    montra New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2011
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Personally, I view faith as having the courage to do what you know to be right. We, at times, have all been in the situation where doing the "right thing" is difficult for various reasons.

    One of my favority passages is in Daniel where three men were about to be sent to their deaths for not worshing idols. Their response was that God would deliver them, but then added, but if not, they would still not bow to their idols. It shows that they knew what was right and would follow it even if it meant their death. It also acknowledged the soveriegnty of God as they were not 100% sure how God would respond.
     
  8. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2009
    Messages:
    8,178
    Likes Received:
    1,077
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok, so at what point exactly did you decide to stop using the actual word faith and its meaning as defined by the English language and exchange it for "doing the right thing"?

    The free dictionary defines faith as

    1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
    2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. See Synonyms at belief, trust.
    3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
    4. often Faith Christianity The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
    5. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
    6. A set of principles or beliefs.

    and I've had a look at a few other definitions, most of them correlate to this one to some extent.

    You could argue that sometimes doing the right thing requires faith (even though there are those who would argue against you if you did), but that doesn't mean that doing the right thing "is" faith.
     
  9. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2010
    Messages:
    7,628
    Likes Received:
    100
    Trophy Points:
    63
  10. montra

    montra New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2011
    Messages:
    5,953
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Sorry, I was not discussing Websters defniition, rather, I was only taking it based upon Biblical extrapolation.

    Bibilically, faith is defined as the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. As Christians, we are to place our faith in God. Additionally, this is a God who is proported to be "good" thus placing our faith in this God causes "good" things to happen at some point.

    I see no real difference in those not of faith placing their faith in other people. You place your faith on the premise that they are "good" on some level and that 'good" things will then be realized if you place your faith in them. Without such faith, life would be miserable.
     
  11. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2009
    Messages:
    8,178
    Likes Received:
    1,077
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Well, I can't stop you from doing so, but I and many with me would appreciate it that you inform us when you're using non-standard meanings for words before we get the discussion going.
    Have you now jumped from arguing that faith is "having the courage to do what you know to be right", which I opposed on linguistic terms, to arguing that _placing_ faith _in God_ (as opposed to the generic term which I questioned) could or will _cause_ _good_ things to happen?

    Underscores added for emphasis, I think that without them, a reader might not pick up on all the differences I would like to point out.

    As much as I take the occasional post to discuss the veracity of claims here or there, making sure that people actually mean what they say is closer to my heart.
    If you've now switched back to the standard definition of faith, then I can probably agree with you on that. Then again, "people of faith" refer to a different definition of faith than placing faith on the premise that a specific person is good. I agree with what I think you're trying to say.
     

Share This Page