Feb Budget Deficit Largest on Record

Repeat fallacy and incomplete data all you want.

 

Deficit is borrowing the difference between spending and taxation to cover spending.

 

And the real world impact of that is it's impact in the debt.
Debt is serviced by the US Economy.
As a percentage of the US economy, our debt position is the best in seven years.



In just two years, Trump has wiped out 5 years of Obama's screw ups on the debt position of the United States. How much MORE improvement will we see by election day 2020?

As a Patriot, even though you can't stand Trump, this improvement in our financial position has to be good news, because it's not only good for you and me, it's good for every taxpayer and worker in America!

And great news for every retiree relying on the US economy to fund their Pensions and Social Security.

Keep It Up Trump!

 

How can we take you seriously when you claim that Reagan had to deal with Carter's poor economy - but that Obama did not have to deal with the remnants of the Bush Recession? That's simply crazy talk with a side order of crazy ...

 

Not at all, why didn't Obama's $800 billion debt bomb fiscal stimulus bill do more for the economy? Because Obama was a historically lame President when it came to recovery and policy. If he knew anything about the subject and was a capable President, his recovery would have been in the 4-5% GDP range overall. Instead, he was 1.6%.

Just looking at facts and numbers, Obama was a mental midget when it came to economy. He was never a businessman and had no decent background in finance or in any other area that would help America. He was professor and a low level lawyer and Senator.

Why would anyone expect him to be good at economics? In fact, he wasn't. Nothing against him, I am sure he was a great Dad or something.

 

Unemployment increased, and interest rates rose to their highest levels in the nation's history under Carter. It took Reagan almost 2 years to dig out of Carter's mess. Reagan rebuilt the military, reinvigorated the economy and increased Medicare which is something President's like Carter couldn't do.

Trump can multi task too, unlike Obama. Obama couldn't increase the military, increase GDP and put America back to work like Trump can. Trump does a lot more and works on many levels. Obama could barely work on one. Unless you count all the destruction Obama did.

 

I'm not claiming that Obama was a financial wizard - but you continue to blame Reagan's 180% increase in the debt on Carter - and then try to pretend that the Bush Recession had no impact on Obama's numbers. Pathetic, dude. Simply pathetic.

 

Trump is adding every bit as much to the debt that Obama did. $2.5 trillion in his first two years. And at least Trump had positive GDP numbers to start with. Obama was working from a NEGATIVE -2.2% economy on his first day - Trump started with a POSITIVE 2.1% GDP. The GDP was raised almost 4% under Obama - Trump has seen a .8% increase.

 

Wrong. I was debating your numbers and how you lacked actual context and to tell the entire truth in regards to Obama, Reagan and the numbers and how they are affected by GDP and economic policies.

You still don't seem to get it. Pathetic is what you tried to pass off as fact.

Obama a financial wizard? Only a select few would make that utter and complete nonsense claim.

 

NOPE! Check the GDP and wait until his term(s) are over. He'll be far better than Obama. Obama was a complete economic disaster and a deficit creating machine.

Obama is by far the worst in history when it comes to this. You have to use all the facts, not cheery pick them.

 

Great post.

This is the problem, they don't understand actual economics. All they want to do is somehow equate Trump and his awesome economy to deficit without actually understanding what is actually happening.

 

The numbers that scream in this table are the debt increases by Reagan and Bush I and II. Why? Because they were run up during a good economy and built on the lies of tax cuts will pay for themselves. You don't empty the national piggybank during good times! Obama? These were, by any measure, disastrous years. Federal revenue plummeted along with GDP and employment. It took eight years to pull the nation out from Bush's economic meltdown.

Bush I had to increase taxes because Reagan's tax cuts were breaking the bank. The first "trickle down" economy. Trump and his Trumpets think tax cuts are a great idea. Guess where this is headed. Clue: reading history tells you.

 

I don't disagree with that. To also be fair, February tends to be the month with the largest monthly deficit.

What I have a REAL problem with is the Trump fans posting countless threads about how Trump is creating some economic miracle, when in reality he is just deficit spending like anyone else to buy himself some good economic numbers. There is nothing magic about it.

Now, the difference is that Trump has record deficits WHEN THE ECONOMY WAS ALREADY STRONG. Wait until the next recession, then we'll easily see +$2 trillion deficits. Just like GWB before him, but on steroids.

 

Most everyone should know it was the Federal Reserve that got the economy rolling again.

 

I don't know what root is of it. It's not had to figure out.

In inflation adjusted dollars, the increase in the debt over Trump's first two years is identical to Obama's last two years, darn near exactly. $2,081,387,828,120.70 vs $2,072,527,750,350.43. You can't distinguish between the two records until you get to the third decimal point. Yet, you have these guys claiming first that Obama had solved the debt problem in his second term and that Trump is an unmitigated fiscal disaster, when it's exactly the same record. These are difficult to find facts, I've probably posted the link to the Treasury site that publishes the US debt position, daily to the penny, with historical searches, probably a hundred times. So, whatever the reason, they have no excuse.

Then when you add to that, the increase in the GDP growth rate of 68%, OF COURSE the US has reduced it's debt to GDP, it's impossible not to, when you increase GDP growth by 68% and keep debt growth flat!

We spend so much in this country on education, and to see these folks, clearly concerned, clearly interested enough to spend a great deal of time discussing and considering it, but they can't handle the simple subtraction and division, even with a calculator to weigh the evidence themselves? Yet they will promptly swallow any pile of crap that falls out of Paul Krugman's mouth?

It's sad, but they are Americans, and we have a knack of figuring things out!

 

Obama set the bar pretty low, Trump is exceeding it nicely. You guys keep claiming that Trump is a debt disaster, when he is posting the best Debt to GDP numbers in SEVEN years!


v.s Obama's final two years when it was soaring out of control.

He's increased the debt in his first 792 days by nearly EXACTLY what Obama increased it in his last 792 days, in constant dollars. $2,081,387,828,120.70 vs $2,072,527,750,350.43 you can't find a difference between those two performances until you get to the third decimal point, yet, he has increased the GDP growth rate by 68% over the same period, so he gets a hell of a lot more GDP out of each debt dollar than Obama did.

Exactly. It's not magic, Trump is finally growing GDP faster than debt, so we see this, over his first two years, our debt finally FALLING in terms of GDP:

Yes, we know how desperately you long for recession.

How can you just make things up?

Bush, who was no prize, Bush and Obama are the two dumbest back to back presidents in the history of the Republic, NEVER has an annual $2T+ debt increase, NOT EVEN CLOSE!



His worst year was his last and the debt increased by $1,152.8B Where are you coming up with this $2T+ crap?

 

Who said Obama had solved the debt problem? I'd like to see that quote.

Obama's debt increase was really bad. Reagan and Bush's increases were horrendous. Trump is on par - as you pointed out - to match Obama.
All I'm saying is that Trump is nothing special. His GDP numbers are worse than Carter's. His job numbers are good - but it wasn't that bad to begin with.

Trump had a much better starting position than Obama is what is being shown. GDP rose just under 4% while Obama was in office and unemployment dropped about 5%. GDP has improved from 2.1% when Trump took office to 2.9% for last year, a .8% improvement. Ok - but not great.

My argument on Trump has always been that any Republican that was running for the office could have done the same ... WITHOUT all the childish Drama Queen behavior and without having half his staff fired because of ethics violations. Trump was a toxic candidate. Republicans could have done better.

 

False. Zorro has already posted the evidence that what you are stating is almost pure fiction. Go read it, go learn it and please go understand it. You can't just pull numbers and expect them to be accurate. It's an incomplete look at economics and the deficit.

Obama was horrendous and was the worst, by far. It's not even debatable if you read Zorro's post. He is 100% correct on this.

 

He is, but with a 68% increase in GDP growth rates.

Late 70's Jimmy Carter? 40 YEARS AGO Carter? Why not compare his numbers to James Polk?

What? Yeah "under" a hundred percent, too. In fact, also under TWO percent!

2016 GDP was 1.9%, the 5th worst showing in 12 years.

Last year's GDP was the best in 12 years, a 68% improvement.

We did do better, than Old Crooked Hillary.

 

You can't claim Zorro's numbers are any more reflective of economic gain or loss than those I posted. He claims that comparing Trumps numbers to a recession plagued Obama's first two years is some type of accurate indicator of success. Trump hasn't even eclipsed Carter's GDP numbers.

And added spending on defense isn't economically sound. Once a tank is build, it doesn't add tax revenue or increase productivity like infrastructure spending does. A tank just sits there demanding maintenance upkeep. You can't recoup money like you could through tax revenue collected on building an airport, or a road. So you have to look where present tax money is being spent to measure future success - and Trump is pumping billions into military hardware that return nothing in the long term to the economy. Save an auto industry - you get long term tax revenue in return - build another aircraft carrier and you get to pay for maintenance of the aircraft carrier until it's scrapped for salvage.

 

In the last recession, the deficit jumped from $459 billion in 2008 to $1,413 billion in 2009. That's basically tripling. And, no, that wasn't because of Obama, it was because the recession caused revenue to collapse and expenditures to increase because unemployment coverage etc, as would be expected for a almost depression, no matter who is in the WH.

Now, think what happens to Trump's $1,152.8B deficit when the next recession hits. Do you think it will not be affected? Or do you think it could triple, just like in 2009? If it triples, the $2 trillion are a VERY conservative estimate.

Of course, you don't want to acknowledge any of this, because you live in your dreamworld of Trump=economic god, which cannot be penetrated by any facts. We've seen it in hundreds of your posts.

 

Last year's GDP was 78% WORSE than "Crooked Hillary's" husband's average GDP. Like I said - Trump ain't special. And Trump hasn't had to deal with a recession - most Presidents have had to.

 

Oh, I sure can. His are far more descriptive and accurate than yours are. So are mine. You are cherry picking a number and trying to prove something that is just not true. I would suggest you learn and understand economics and the effect of GDP on deficit. Seriously, if you understood this and you look at it in a completely nonpartisan manner, you will be astounded.

 

Carter - 43% increase in the debt during his fiscal years in office. (just 4 years).
Reagan - 186% increase in the debt during his fiscal years in office.
Bush I - 54% increase in the debt during his fiscal years on office (just 4 years).
Clinton - 32% increase in the debt during his fiscal years in office.
Bush II - 101% increase in the debt during his fiscal years in office.
Obama - 79% increase in the debt during his fiscal years in office.

The figures above are complete and in context. You know that.

What is fallacious and out of context is for you to condemn Obama without being transparent and objective about the economic situation into which he came, caused by Bush and the GOP all the way back to 1994.

 

Statistical nonsense since President do not singularly control budgets and deficits. Congress has budget control.