How can evil exist without God?

I could accept anything provided there was credible evidence to suggest it's existence. It doesn't have to be a proven theory, but the evidence does have to point to something. As it is now, supernatural events could just as easily be explained by levels of human consciousness that we aren't aware of. I could just as easily say that human beings possess powers beyond the realm of our understanding but that we simply don't know how to use them, except for maybe a small handful of people who have tapped into that potential. It's not that I don't want to believe in a God, it's that I can't without equally believing in any other possibility that doesn't involve him.

 

True, I don't know for sure. The same with a creator. And if something must be infinite is more probable the Universe than a creator.

 

There you are 'stuck' in your quandary: As per NT scripture, "Without faith it is impossible to please God, for He is a rewarder of those who 'diligently' seek Him." Faith is the 'currency' of His realm..and so, unless something in your life changes, you will remain stuck out on that ledge...

BTW, funny sig..ha ha

 

God is evil if one takes the Bible literally just read some acts condoned and/or ordered or done by God in the OT and compare them to say the Nazi Regime and its crimes against civilization and humanity.

If the Bible is allegory stories about morality and represent God he is still evil since such stories offer no morality.

If God is just a big man in the sky and is generally okay but can be a prick with a bad temper fine then make him like that sort of neutral to good and evil some of each.

My view is morality of a good God and who is truly just would have morality even in the OT superior to what humans consider with reason in this age, and I don't see it. To a humanist of a secular bent I don't support genocide, rape, slavery, gender inequality, war of aggression and supporting forces that historically did so or do now or who may appear later. God if taken on two counts the OT real or OT stories fails those tests. Even Jesus was not flawless or the apostles and the Book of Revelation is just as offensive as the OT tales.

I would say from my view if God is real he is evil, if not his followers support evil ideas since they clearly use this book as truth or allegorical stories teaching a bad moral code with few redeeming qualities.

 

That doesn't seem fair though. Back in the days of the OT and Christ, real tangible miracles were occurring(according to the bible) all the time. Sodom and Gomorrah, the flood, the tower of Babel, numerous healing, water into wine, the resurrection, Moses and the Pharaoh, Jonah and the whale, and more that I've forgotten or never knew about to begin with. They didn't need to have "faith", they got to see miraculous acts occurring. They had their "proof" if you will.

It just seems too convenient to me. All we're supposed to do is have "faith" in God?, no proof? That to me just sounds like a cop-out, no offense. It sounds like the people who wrote the bible knew what they were selling.

 

After Jesus' resurrection and the 'doubt of Thomas' saying "until I see, feel, I will not believe in His resurrection "(my para), After showing Himself to Thomas, Jesus said "More blessed are those who do not see and yet believe."

His miracles were testaments of Who He was, and Who sent Him, and validated His words, per 1/2 dozen NT scriptues so sayiing. Following Pentecost, the 1st Fruits of the Christian church, and the 'explosion' (just as the H. Spirit 'blew' into the upper room and manifested upon all there in it) of the testimony of Jesus Christ with 'power' to kickoff the start of the Church of Jesus Christ.

Miracles were more dramatic because of the faith of the early disciples, who were bold and fearless, being as scriptures said, 'full of the Holy Spirit."

Miracles have happened thru the ages following, more so in numbers but most not as dramatic, and there are records of today with both personal testimonies and, some cases, with medical records.

But if faith is the currency even in an unbelieving and faithless world as we seem to have today, per James "a double-minded man will not receive anything from God," as being both carnal in believing & unbelieving, and not as many miracles are manifested as in the early church days..

 

if the creator doesn’t need one why would anything need one and if the universe needs to come from something else that’s eternal whys that thing have to be a person

 

Quantum mechanics, that's what you put your faith in? BWAH HA HA HA HA! The Easter Bunny will be here next week. BWAH HA HA HA HA!

 

Saying that God is evil is also saying evil is God. If you subscribe to that, you are enslaved to evil. The bible was written by men, not God. All men are ignorant of God, because God can't be contained in the human mind. God can't be contained in the any bible. God can't be contained in anything.

 

him or your god BWAH HA HA HA! seems like a dick thing to say but do unto others and all of that your wellcome

 

Such an intelligent response.

I am impressed.

 

no even if a god exists and you consider it good or evil it is not all things good or evil just a person with super powers that might be responsible for every thing else existing

 

It doesn't matter what I consider, or you, or anyone. Considering God a "person" is as far off as it gets. There are universal laws, that's reality. Those are God's laws. You can refuse to "believe" those laws, like some christians do. i.e. "believing" the world is only ten thousand years old, instead of the reality of a billion years old. Creation is a reality. Creation is positive energy. Creation is God. Destruction is evil. Evil is negative energy. Positive energy exists without negative energy, but not visa versa.

 

o your going with god is every thing every thing is a part of god atheism/theism/ i cant see a difrance well in that case i guess the only way to make god all good or all evil would be to judge everything as good or evil and for most peapole god would be both

 

Everything is what it is, even a devils advocate.

 

No, I think there is such a thing as evil. In fact I think that in most cases evil is unmistakable. I certainly don't need a book to tell me that, for example, an adult abducting a screaming child is not a good thing. And if you and I were standing together and witnessed such an event I don't think, as we both ran to help, that we would be doing it for different reasons.

But if it turned out that there is no god, that the bible wasn't divinely inspired, the difference is that I would go on with my life as if nothing had happened. But for people like you who argue that the only way to understand good and evil is via the bible, I fear for the rest of us. How would you know not to go on a murdering, raping, homosexual-themed killing spree if it weren't for the good book? For my own protection I'm glad you're a believer.

 

If there were no God, good and evil would be defined strictly by what is best for the survival of the species.

We have the fossil record to guide us there.

The fossils of every know human ancestor include individuals who would have been incapable of survival by themselves. Eric Trinkaus mentions that the typical Neanderthal skeleton shows the same sorts of trauma as would that of a professional bull rider. Lots of healed fractures to the arms, legs and ribs and skull. They obviously had some concept of charity. If nobody takes care of you when you are sick or injured in the sorts of environments in which early hominids lived, you're hyena chow. It takes a serious numerical advantage for a group of people no bigger than a chimpanzee to fend off the big predators to ensure the survival of the group.

Thus, there are characteristics that could be called moral or immoral or noble of vile, whether you are speaking of the laws of nature or of God. Cowardice is evil because it denies your obligatory service to the defense of the collective and courage is noble because it enhances the chances that the collective will survive. Neglect or deliberate harm to another member of your community is, then, inately evil and charity and altruism are inately good.

Whether morality comes from God or nature, then, as it is written in the Talmud:
"The essence of the law is this; that which is hateful unto you, you shall not do to another. All else is but commentary."

 

You left out the best part: Now go and learn it.

 

naa would explain why you and others would think that way but survival of the individual or species is not good of itself either even of that opinion is self-preserving and some time it might be better for survival to just run away from danger

 

Morality is all opinion based. There might be a person that thinks killing and raping people is a fun thing to do. From a logical stand point those actions are harmful to society, therefore they are illogical and socially unaccepted.

 

I find your understanding of nuclear physics, or should I say lack thereof, to be amusing. Please, continue talking about concepts you know (*)(*)(*)(*)-all about.

Pro-tip: Radioactive fallout is minimal except in the case of a groundburst detonation or a radiological device. After a nuclear detonation due to the heat you have a lot of evaporated moisture in the atmosphere which condenses as it cools taking with it most of the radioactive particulate, this results in a phenomenon know by the Hiroshima and Nagasaki survivors as 'black rain'. In other words the fallout is collected into the water and due to radioactive materials being significantly denser than water they stay where they fall or are washed away. In fact the largest collection of uranium is found in, guess where? The Oceans. Then you have to account for the half-life of an individual particle. If physics operated the way you thought it did Hiroshima and Nagasaki would still be glowing like the sun, whereas in reality the radiation levels had fallen back down to below the background radiation level (IE the level of radiation that occurs naturally) by the late fifties.

Cancer rates are higher today because we live significantly longer and are exposed to radiation levels and toxins for far longer than our predecessors were. It has nothing to do with nuclear testing except in very specific cases.

 

the 'pro-tip' is ignornant to the physics in more than one level.

For example; the energy released of a detonation imposes to the mass within the exposed environment.

The energy as in moving particles are just a portion of the energy in wavelengths.

the mass captures the energy by exposure at each moment in time and of each converted wavelength, upon each layer of exposure.

That energy has exposed the atmosphere with 'vapor' of many combinations of mass, irradiated under the magnetosphere and has been circling the earth for generations now.


if you would like some lessons in science. Please go to the science section and we can talk a bit.

 

"Evil" is a human concept, which exists in that sense without God the same way anything exists without God. God is another human concept of course.

 

how can evil exist without you?

 

yeah yeah god is everywhere and just watches and does nothing as that 'evil' happens?

what would you say about someone that stood and watched and did nothing?

can that kinda god exist?