Nikki Haley? any chance??

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by gringo, Feb 15, 2023.

  1. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Lack of mental acuity and betrayal of the Afghans.
     
  2. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Some third party candidates have pointed the way to the future.
     
  3. Lewis Edward Smith

    Lewis Edward Smith Newly Registered

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    Trump will get the Republican nomination but not a chance of getting enough votes to be president. Nikki Haley will be known she is going to run again in 2028. Kamala it is known she will be president at least a couple of years before that election and will run in the next term.
     
  4. gorfias

    gorfias Well-Known Member

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    Most of the Biden supporters I know openly state they did so as a vote against Trump, not out of support for Biden himself. Today, It is Biden that may have the most negative polling numbers of a POTUS ever. Between the MAGA that would crawl over broken glass to vote for Trump, the independents that believe Trump would fix things they believe Biden wrecked, and that 2024, hopefully, will not be "fortified" you really think Biden has a chance? Do you have poll or opinion piece (or other report) to which you can link that brings you to believe this?
     
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  5. Endeavor

    Endeavor Well-Known Member

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    Do they diagnose mental acuity by watching video clip ?
     
  6. gorfias

    gorfias Well-Known Member

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    gfm7175 likes this.
  7. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    That's one way. There have been countless examples.
     
  8. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Afghans were not betrayed. When the pull-out agreement was made, they made their own deals with the Taliban, and joined forces with them as soon as we left, and even before it.
     
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  9. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    There were still organized Afghan units fighting as our evacuation aircraft lifted off.
    We abandoned them; that caused some to try to save themselves, but we were the cause.
    Perspective|Afghans were willing to fight. But we abandoned them on the battlefield.
    The United States built their military in our image, not theirs, but still we soldiered side by side.August 19, 2021
     
  10. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Very few. Vast majority joined Taliban, because it put them in charge of the country.

    We were never going to stay there forever, and we were never going to take everyone with us. I'm glad we are out of that place, and IMO the agreement was one of the few things Trump got right.
     
  11. Endeavor

    Endeavor Well-Known Member

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    Sure. Diagnose mental acuity over internet. Must be very credible.
     
  12. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Your first claim is simply false. Perhaps it's comforting for those who feel guilty.
    We've been in Germany for 79 years. In South Korea for 74. Success in Afghanistan was always going to be a long term proposition. That's why smart people in DoD coined the name "The Long War."
     
  13. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    I didn't say internet. The point stands.
     
  14. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, its true. The Afghans did not put up a fight, and let Taliban take over.

    We are not fighting a war in Germany or Korea. They (and Japan) actually pay to house US troops, while Afghanistan was a constant money hole.
     
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  15. Endeavor

    Endeavor Well-Known Member

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    Telepathy then? Because I don’t think Joe Biden invited you to WH to diagnose his mental state.
     
  16. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Afghanistan was really pretty cheap, and our forces in both Germany and Korea are quite a bit larger, more spohisticated and more expensive. Host nations pay support costs but not the direct costs of our forces.
    As I said, Afghans were still fighting when we ran out.
     
  17. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    There have been countless credible reports. By the same token, I need not be present for every Donald Trump vulgarity to know he's a thoughtless boor.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2024
  18. Endeavor

    Endeavor Well-Known Member

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    We have been in Germany 79 years because German wants Americans in Germany. Since the D Day , how many American military personal died in Germany?

    Same with South Korea. They want us there.

    Can you say the same thing about Afghanistan? This was the problem with W Bush’ foreign policy after 9/11. I liked W Bush policy until 9/11 but then he went on to a “ Wet Dream” to bring democracy in ME. I spent time in ME ( I know you have too) and in South East Asia , those Muslims are not going to accept western style democracy. They might post in face book and drink Johney Walker, but they will not accept western democracy. US could stay in Afghanistan another 20 years but those Mullah’s wouldn’t let girls go to school or university.
     
  19. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes, the Afghans wanted us there. And girls were already going to school and university while we were there.
     
  20. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Say what you wish, but the outcome is what it is. Taliban took control lighting fast due to lack of resistance.

    Why did the Afghan army disintegrate so quickly?
    The billions spent by the US and NATO on the Afghan military could not fix major internal flaws.
    https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/...ugust 15, the Taliban,up a fight shocked many.
    On August 15, the Taliban captured the Afghan capital Kabul and declared the war in Afghanistan over. The lightning speed with which the group made major territorial gains as the Afghan National Defence Security Forces (ANDSF) retreated without putting up a fight shocked many.

    Over the last 20 years, the US spent more than $83bn training, equipping and developing the Afghan national army, police, air force, and special forces. Yet, under the advance of an armed group carrying light weapons, the ANDSF fell apart in a spectacular fashion.

    Unsurprisingly, the ANDSF had one of the highest desertion and casualty rates in the world. According to one estimate, the ANDSF’s per month attrition rate was 5,000 while the recruitment rate was 300 to 500.
     
  21. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Please see the link in my #1959. And please do not again cite aljazeera propaganda.
    ". . . And then the president said this: “American troops cannot and should not be fighting in a war and dying in a war that Afghan forces are not willing to fight for themselves.” The Afghan military has consistently, in any one year, sustained more casualties in its fight against the Taliban than we have sustained in all 20 years of our war there. I fought alongside the Afghans. I watched them save American lives. In one instance, when a convoy I was in was ambushed, our Afghan partners were the first to drive back into the kill-zone to pick up wounded Americans. To say they are unwilling to fight because their forces collapsed after we turned our backs on them is a slap in the face not only to our Afghan allies but to Americans — such as me — who mixed our spilled blood with theirs. . . . "
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2024
  22. Endeavor

    Endeavor Well-Known Member

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    yep they wanted American in Afghanistan . these numbers speak for itself

    Afghanistan casualty by President

    Bush - 630
    Obama 1758
    Trump 64
    Biden 13
     
  23. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Every casualty is to be regretted, but comparatively speaking that's peanuts. KIA in Afghanistan and Iraq combined were only one tenth of US KIA in Vietnam.
    And the Afghan forces suffered more casualties every year than US forces suffered in their entire 20 years in the country.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2024
  24. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    WaPo. Please do not quote WaPo again.

    They gave up the country without a fight. I'd be lying if I said otherwise. Taliban walked into most cities without firing a shot.

    PS I am not saying they never fought, I am saying they didn't fight when we were leaving.

    You don't like the source? What they said is factually correct.

    How the Afghan Army Collapsed Under the Taliban’s Pressure
    https://www.cfr.org/in-brief/how-afghan-army-collapsed-under-talibans-pressure
    A reporter asked U.S. President Joe Biden in July whether a Taliban takeover of Afghanistan was inevitable. “No, it is not,” he said, pointing to the presence of three hundred thousand “well-equipped” Afghan security personnel.

    Little more than a month later, the Afghan military completely collapsed. It lost control of much of the country, often without putting up a fight, and allowed the Taliban to take over. Near the end, provincial capitals fell with dizzying rapidity. On August 15, Taliban fighters marched into Kabul.

    Why didn't they fight? Speed of Afghan collapse surprised even the Taliban

    The Taliban's rapid takeover of Afghanistan was the result of not only their strength on the battlefield and a strategy that began in the rural provinces but of a collapse of morale among an underserved Afghan military.
    https://www.france24.com/en/asia-pa...of-afghan-collapse-surprised-even-the-taliban
    Despite the $83 billion and two decades the US spent equipping and training the Afghan army, in many provinces the military appeared to evaporate in the face of Taliban insurgents.

    With more than 300,000 personnel and equipment that was more advanced than the Taliban arsenal, Afghan army forces were formidable – on paper. In reality, they had been plagued by corruption, payoffs, poor leadership, lack of training and plummeting morale for years.

    Desertions were common and US government inspectors had long warned that the situation was unsustainable.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2024
  25. gfm7175

    gfm7175 Well-Known Member

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    Thankfully it is ONLY the DC swamp who wants her. There isn't a single state in the nation that wants her. They all want Trump.
     
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