Petition to ban Trump from meeting the queen gathers a million signatures

Against Trump yell hypocritical scoundrels. Or crazy. Those who imports and kept wild hordes of migrants at the expense of the indigenous population of the country.

 

It was the Brits' petition...no one but Libs are hysterical. Britain needs the US. Do you think the EU wants to help you?

 

This is beyond politics, beyond words. Forget all that.

Are you a Trump Supporter?

 

You have that right Fred.

 

Trump would need to have the Secret Service bring a vacuum cleaner to clear out the years of dust that would have been stored there.

 

Don't worry soon the senile old Trump be banned from the UK.

He can use his Twitter. Staring at the computer screen while he pisses himself like Ronald Reagan.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...ll-biggest-ever-uk-protest-oppose-trump-visit

With over 1.8 million having already signed to say No to a State Visit, this should be no problem.

 

British are truly aware of what's happening. Nice !

 

How do you think he'll do that ?

 

You have been our lapdog since Suez, don't pretend you are anything less...

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NATO ensured nothing, the American conventional and nuclear arsenal did that...

 

It's not far enough, snakestretcher. The US is THE hegemon, what it does effects us all. I'm in Australia and it's not far enough away, either.

Both our countries get dragged into US "humanitarian interventions" time and again and our public social security systems are being eaten piece by piece by American style capitalist "freedom" because our politicians are too gutless to resist and too privileged and greedy to even want to try.

Mind you, resistance is a little futile and if you buck the system too hard you're "put on notice" and end up with a "humanitarian intervention".

 

Trump should not be vetted he will not visit Britain to become a citizen or something,
well, the Al fayed with Princess Di scenario did not make them much cleaner either.

 

Much of the xenophobia itself is the spawn of the morons elected to save us from ourselves, moon. We were given an enemy to focus our anger and anxiety on so we wouldn't notice the economic effects of the political choices made in implementing global Neoliberal capitalism. We blamed immigrants for the jobs and the welfare state disappearing instead.

The distraction worked very well. It's still working.

And all the so-called Left offered was identity politics, because the so called Left leaders were economic Neoliberalists, too.

The Romans called it bread and circuses. Modern politics guarantees the circuses, only.

 

Would it be possible that the few dissidents in the UK will pout, cry a bit and let Trump get on with the business of the two nations?

1.8 million you claim? Your entire kingdom is smaller than the state north of me, Oregon.

Who do you think you are?

61 million of you and who knows if your protestors are Muslims?

Trump got a ration of crap from, Australia. Now you want a part of Trump too?

http://www.ciaworldfactbook.us/europe/uk.html

 

True. It was a very low voter turnout. The arrogance and complacency of the Democrat's insistence on Clinton as the Presidential candidate was mind blowing. But she did win the popular vote.

You guys really need to do something about your Electoral College. Might be an idea to stop disenfranchising hundreds of thousands of voters, too.

 

We don't vote by this thing so called popular vote.

And there are sound reasons why we stick to what the founders handed to us.

Take a state such as Wyoming. You have to go miles to locate a human. sort of kidding.

But the point is the state is larger than the United Kingdom. The UK is approximately the size of Oregon. Oregon is a medium sized state. We in CA wield enormous power over elections. Take us, New York, Florida and several more, and we can name any president we want to.

This leaves out the rest of the nation.

Do you really want the majority of America left out merely because several of the states have immense power?

 

Lol! Already? He's only been President two weeks! Dear oh dear, Taxpayer!
(Thanks for the laugh

 

My understanding is the Electoral College basically gives equal representation in Congress and the Senate to that empty state of Wyoming as it does to those well populated states you mentioned, Robert, and that means the majority end up under represented. We call it gerrymandering over here.

The state I live in used to be infamous for it for 30 years. It was a national joke. The people of Queensland took to the streets in protest repeatedly and the Premier ( our equivalent of your Governor ) would send troopers out to beat them up. There's still some gerrymandering, but it's not so blatant.

I'm honestly unconvinced that sticking to what the Founding Fathers decreed more than 300 years ago is sound. I see no evidence that they were blessed with clairvoyance. I do see evidence suggesting they saw the Constitution as a living, breathing, evolving document.

My nation's Founding Fathers gave people fifty lashes with the cat'o'nine tails or transportation for life for thieving a loaf of bread. Few would argue either were appropriate now.

What do you think about the disenfranchisement of so many Americans?

Nice to talk to you again, by the way.

 

The EC has nothing to do with congress or the Senate (congress is both houses by the way the house of reps and the Senate make up congress).


We call that evening things out here. Our election is not decided by who gets the most votes but basically who carries most of the country by state. In other wortds its the states not the people who elect the president. We are not a democracy

The founders were brilliant. If only we had such men today

 

I love how the American Democrats allege the constitution lives and breathes and changes.

Now I see you in Australia also use that term.

We have a clause to cover changes. We call that amending.

If it does too much living and breathing, we won't recognize it long.

Books are written on the merits of the current system. I did not wish to engage in such things so took a short cut. Still you got it.

We are republics. We have 50 and I am certain you know this. Each republic needs way to get a kind of chance.

A very few of them, called states, could put the rest out of the game. The popular vote is no solution. Which is why we have not amended the constitution to make it that way.

I am curious. Does Australia also support the Queen and her family with citizens money?

England puzzles me why they pay millions of dollars to support her. We get a president for a measly $400,000 plus his expenses.

Add in what Penrod told you ...

Nice talking to you as well.

 

The constitution is the foundation of our nation. Who wants a foundation that moves with the prevailing wind ?

 

Well Robert, on your preference for keeping the Constitution exactly as written and allowing empty Wyoming as many representatives in government as crowded New York state based on square mileage, all I can say is I'm very glad Australia doesn't whip thieves anymore.

Incidentally, I am not a liberal. I despise liberals - particularly economic liberals , but also social liberals and their divisive identity politics. I have no patience whatsoever with the cult of individual freedom liberalism espouses. I'm all about social cohesion and stability: the good of the many.

On the British monarchy, most Australians want a Republic and have for a few decades now, but the last time we were asked, we were:
1. asked by a Monarchist administration
2. asked by a Referenda - in the administration's full and certain knowledge that if we are asked to decide more than one issue in this format (hence Referenda, not Referendum) we get suspicious, think the pollies are trying to pull a swifty, and we vote "no" to everything and
3. asked in such a convoluted, confusing way that was more about peripheral issues anyway, that the "no" response by the majority was pretty much guaranteed.

Interestingly, our current PM used to be the head of the national Republican movement. He was asked recently if he would revisit the question of Australia finally becoming a Republic, based on overwhelming support for it in the polls for decades. His response? "Oh. Perhaps when Her Majesty passes away. Now is not the time."

On your question about us funding the Royal Privilege, we don't on an everyday basis anymore and haven't for decades, but we foot the bill- every bloody cent of it- when they grace us with a Royal Visit on our shores. Doesn’t matter which of them visit, we shout 'em lock, stock and barrel. Most Australians don't seem to realise this. They still seem to expect rich people like the Royals to actually pay their own way in this world. Quaint, isn't it? At heart, Australians still believe the world is egalitarian and each contributes according to their ability. We still believe in "a fair go", even as we vote in politicians with policies that further widen and entrench inequality and xenophobia.

Most of our media is also owned by an arch Monarchist - bloke called Rupert Murdoch- who can be relied upon to whip up noisy Royal fervour in the public that effectively drowns out the majority's desire to break all ties with the British monarchy. Strangely, he now seems to do it by publishing endless articles on Denmark's Princess Mary, probably because she's Australian.

 

Does anyone apart from me find this strange. Our governments, UK, America the west in general. They shout at the world, the middle east, Russia, China etc... about the joys of Democracy. They must have it. To be democratic and free. But when we in the west practise this democracy in protests or any civil strike our governments suddenly stop believing in democracy.

This online petition. Is just the current example. Shouldn't it be welcomed as a practising of democratic values instead of the Americans (Trump Supporters) trying to silence what they boast is free Democratic speech?

 

Well, Politicalhound, I guess it's strange if you believe we actually have democracies. Do we have democracies, or do we have corporate capitalist oligarchies with democratic forms? Do elections equal democracy when the policies the majority want are completely, knowingly ignored in favour of the policies the oligarchy want?

I personally don't have an opinion on the petition, though I completely agree with you that as an example of free speech, you'd think Americans with their freedom fetish would support it. I see Trump's election as symptomatic of the demise of democracy I outlined above.

I think we only had a semblance of democracy for a brief period of time - between the Second World War and the 1970's. We had it in the form of workers rights, entitlements, decent wages and full employment, and the only reason we had it was because the oligarchy needed our labour. They'd wasted so many of us in two world wars, we stopped marrying and breeding during the Great Depression, our numbers were down and labour hadn't been offshored yet: it was a case of give in to the majority's demands, treat us well and continue to make money, or bring in full blown fascism, waste more of us, have no one to provide the labour and lose money. We never really had democracy. Nobody ever has. Athenian democracy wasn't democratic, either. Democracy's a Utopian dream. All we've ever had is oligarchies.

Now labour's offshored. The oligarchy doesn't need us anymore. It can do what it likes, and it will continue to distract us with fears of immigrants in general and terrorists in particular while reassuring us we live in the best of all possible worlds because we live in a "democracy".

 

Ummmmm

Thanks