UK will classify "Islamist extremism" as distinct ideology

They arent criminalizing Islamic extremist, merely classifying it as a distinct ideology to avoid offending the muslims.

 

But I suspect law enforcement is the reason for this label.

 

Nah, I doubt law enforcement is as concerned with offending Muslims, as the politicians who came up with this plan to avoid offending them.

 

Weak argument. But since you mention it, why would you not want to avoid offending anyone? Isn't that what decent people do?

 

Sure, sure. And then this



has led to this:



You Britons continue sitting in your pubs; nothing' going on here

 

Not all of us my friend.. not all of us.
Soon changes will come and illegal immigrants will be forced to leave the island.

 

Not when it requires the suspension of reality.

 

When does your visa expire?

 

There are many who read the Christian Bible very literally OR claim to, I should say. It's interesting seeing what they do when there are flat out discrepancies between two verses.

An eye for an eye is in the OT, and Jesus explicitly rejects it in the NT and says love your enemy. And somehow we have huge numbers of American right wing conservative Christians strong supporters of war.

Go figure.

 

What discrepency?

Ephesians 2
15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations.

Hebrews 8
13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

Romans 10
4Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.(*)

Romans 7
6But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

2 Corinthians 3
13We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at it while the radiance was fading away. 14But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away.

Galatians 3 13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

23Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ[h] that we might be justified by faith. 25Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law(*)

Matthew 5:
38 You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.
39 But I say to you, Do not resist the evil man [who injures you]; but if anyone strikes you on the right jaw or cheek, turn to him the other one too.
40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your undershirt (tunic), let him have your coat also.
41 And if anyone forces you to go one mile, go with him two [miles].
42 Give to him who keeps on begging from you, and do not turn away from him who would borrow [[a]at interest] from you.
43 You have heard that it was said, You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy;
44 But I tell you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Sooooo I wouldnt attribute their support of war to their christianity. It is in spite of their christianity.

 

I think Cameron's government is correct. Al-Qaeda's branch of Islam is a new phenomena: ideologized Islam (as if Nazism or Communism had been explicitly Christian, for example). The willingness to take innocent Muslim lives in pursuit of their agenda (more Shia have been killed by Islamofacists then Westerners have been, by quite a bit) and the willingness to totally warp the meaning of some Koranic passages to justify atrocities are actions that are ideological in nature.

What I don't trust the British to do is to come up with a good definition of Islamofascism (or Islamist extremism, or whatever they call it) and APPLY IT CONSISTENTLY! They are much too sensitive to political and economic pressure from the Gulf states, for instance, and Saudi Arabia and Qatar have their fingers all over the Islamofascist movement.

 

For 60 years the Shia were considered radicals.. and all of a sudden its the Gulf State Sunnis... AQ certainly is powerful.

 

The Sunnis have been slaughtering Shia almost as long as Islam has been in existance and nothing new about AlQaedas Ideology. Same (*)(*)(*)(*) different day.

And it is the literal meaning of Koranic passages that cause most of the problems. Not "warped" ones.

[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.(*)

[2.193] And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah...(*)

2.216] Fighting is enjoined on you, and h is an object of dislike to you; and it may be that you dislike a thing while it is good for you, and it may be that you love a thing while it is evil for you, and Allah knows, while you do not know.

[2.244] And fight in the way of Allah,...

[2.246] ...May it not be that you would not fight if fighting is ordained for you? They said: And what reason have we that we should not fight in the way of Allah, and we have indeed been compelled to abandon our homes and our children. But when fighting was ordained for them, they turned back, except a few of them, and Allah knows the unjust.

[3.151] We will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve, because they set up with Allah that for which He has sent down no authority, and their abode is the fire, and evil is the abode of the unjust.

[3.169] And reckon not those who are killed in Allah's way as dead; nay, they are alive (and) are provided sustenance from their Lord;

[4.74] Therefore let those fight in the way of Allah, who sell this world's life for the hereafter; and whoever fights in the way of Allah, then be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty reward.

[4.76] Those who believe fight in the way of Allah, and those who disbelieve fight in the way of the Shaitan. Fight therefore against the friends of the Shaitan; surely the strategy of the Shaitan is weak.

[9.5] So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

[9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

[9.111] Surely Allah has bought of the believers their persons and their property for this, that they shall have the garden; they fight in Allah's way, so they slay and are slain;(*)

[9.123] O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

[47.4] So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them

 

Yes of course I second that <DECENT PEOPLE>... minus the un decent, the thieves, the murderers, the rapists, the homosexuals after young boys. etc.,

 

Nah, its merely a strict, literal interpretation of the same ideology found in the Koran

 

Absolutely the same ideology + a bee, some are stung several times, some less, and some more than others, depends really whose ox has been gored and they react to frivolous, inane hearsay's, they react to chimeras (72 virgins and boys like pearls in Muslim Paradise) they believe in martyrdom (to secure a place in heaven)... all that BS, etc., How else would the men in charge and these clerics that excite the throng would make a name for themselves?

 

Which Koran verses have they warped as opposed to interpreting in the way of Medieval/Classical jurists?

 

This is a very big question to answer, but I'll start by saying that Qutbists/Islamofascists reject any innate authority of the Medieval/Classical jurists, saying that errors have crept in over time and have distorted the pure message of Islam ("pure" being their very narrow and ideological interpretation, of course). I refer you to the following links:

http://www.terrorismanalysts.com/pt/index.php/pot/article/view/104/html
http://web.utk.edu/~warda/bin_ladin_and_quran.htm
http://www.islamdaily.org/en/islam/2738.moderate-muslims-using-quran-to-wage-counter-jihad.htm
http://www.juancole.com/2013/04/islamic-forbids-terrorism.html

 

What's interesting and relevant to this discussion is that Qutb's interpretation of the Qur'an steadily grew more radical in response to certain personal and political events in his life ( e.g. his stay in America, and the Egyptian government's clampdown on the MB).

 

" Britain to tackle "Islamist extremism" after soldier's murder "
well its about time !!!

 

" They arent criminalizing Islamic extremist "
HUH ..WHAT ???
ARENT THIS ARENT THAT ??? SO WHAT THE F@@@ R THEY GOING TO DO ??? NOTHING ???
SAME OLD ww2 with hitler they did nothing first!!!

 

and the jews don't want to take over the world...only what god gave them..nothing more

 

It seems to be because more evidence is growing that Anjem Choudray possibly has a more dangerous role than was previously thought

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...undreds-to-join-alqaida-in-syria-8960883.html

he certainly seems to have been a go between between the radical Islamists from whom Lee Ribgy's murders gained an 'understanding' of the Koran and became Muslims. Panorama did a program on this recently and they seem to have been involved in about 20% of known Muslim terror things concerning the UK.

It was weird how the radical's can sit so serene and gentle and yet promote and applaud the behaviour they do.

Another part of this is that many Muslims are genuinely angry about what British involvement has done to Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iraq. They know of the drone strikes and the killing of civilians and what not which goes on and I heave read they often get irritated that what they hear said in the British Parliament is not true according to what they hear from relatives. Clearly these are the people radicals are after to encourage them to take revenge.

 

Cameron is just an old-school Etonian fascist. As regards this particular revelation, I'm guessing he didn't give you a full historical account of how Islamic extremism began, which was with the deliberate planning and encouragement of the American CIA in the late 1970s, as a weapon against the Russians. The attack dog is now biting its master, and its master isn't happy about it.

 

Good to know that Islamic extremism is only a few decades old.