The word "person" is irrelevant to the discussion as it is not a part of my question. Answer my question.
You don't have ANY idea which pregnancies were the result of rape. And, you will notice from this thread that it is most definitely NOT a lone argument. In fact, only a few posts back you were whining about there being too many different arguments beging presented.
The majority of America disagrees with your position. Pitching the majority view as extremist is an incredibly weak direction for you to take. Not only that, but your last sentence proves you aren't even listening.
?? There have been medically induced abortions for thousands of years. And, yes. There is a history of desperation that severe even here in the USA.
There are records of abortion that go back thousands of years BC. I've never heard anyone claim that there was a time when abortion did not exist. It goes back far enough that I suspect there isn't enough evidence to support a claim that abortion didin't exist.
Ritter said: ↑ Let's get back on topic: Do you approve of forcing a woman to be pregnant against her will? A woman who has expressed no desire to be a mother? Is some mystical being in heaven the reason for this? So you expect others to answer questions but CAN'T answer any your self.... SO predictable...
FoxHastings said: ↑ Persons aren't human ? WTF? So you expect others to answer your questions but haven't enough ammo to answer questions... got it !
Your question involved playing word games. Everyone already knows that you want to give a fetus at least some of the protections we give persons. You can be direct about that. You don't have to play word games.
These definitions are just plain BS. It''s your further attempt to play word games. Not that it matters even one tiny bit, but humans can have a heart beat and be brain dead. A fetus can have a heart beat yet have no chance at viability or can still be damned to a lifetime of suffering should the pregnancy be allowed to continue. A fetus can have a heart beat yet represent severe trauma or death for the woman. And, defining "human" is just one more example of your word games. My little toe is human - a clear demostration of how silly your word games have become. The bottom line remains that this is an area where the woman gets to decide. She is the only one who knows the full situation. Unlike with persons, it is her body. Once born (or perhaps once viable) we can start talking about the rights of persons. Until then, it is HER body. Using our legal system to enforce YOUR opinion on her is just plain not acceptable. Very importantly, there are ways we can reduce the number of abortions in America WITHOUT using laws against women. Making laws against women is not the only approach to reducing the number of abortions in America. You don't get to claim laws as the only chance you have at making things right with your God or moral code.
I guess we are in agreement. Now let's see what kind of mental acrobatics you will pull off further below. Correct... Right... Hahahahahahahahaha. Fantastic! Not falling for that. It is rather ironic that you keep pointing out that human beings are human beings and not animals, yet you hold a belief that implies women are to be treated as stock form animals with neither personal- nor reproductive freedom. To you, sex is just a primitive desire that , just like for cattle, is to be used for reproduction only and even in a time with contraceptives and safe abortions, you want man to return to the state of the primitive where parenthood is "up to nature" or "to the hands of God" rather than allowing it to be a rational and purposeful choice. Furthermore, you want to give a developing human being not only the same rights as - but, even greater - rights than that of a fully developed, adult human being. Demanding the latter to sacrifice all her life, rights, liberties and values in favour of the survival of the previous is monstrously evil! You hold evil beliefs on abortion. Your views on abortion are fundamentally anti-life and to call yourself pro-life is thus a big sham.
Abortion is not murder because murder only applies to the forceful killing of another actualised human life. Abortion is not murder because murder only applies to the forceful killing of another actualised human life. Abortion is not murder because murder only applies to the forceful killing of another actualised human life. Get it? Fetuses are not persons and only persons have rights. Abortion is good. Separetly and independently. Don't you get it, Darwin? I am saying a 12 year old is a "pre-teen" and you are a "pre-corpse". The 24 year old has been born and existed as a separate entity from its mother for almost three drcades. It has had individual rights for the same amount of time. Capisce? No. Rights. Until. Birth.
A few pages ago - or perhaps in another thread - I presented a list of the various forms of anti-abortionists and what it is that drives their respective opposition. So far, all of my observations have been proven to be accurate.
Due to modern contraception, they don't need to. However, if contraception didn't exist, but the 'Friday night girls' had the same level of sexual activity that they do today, needless to say that there would be quite a bit more aborting going on. Although, whether or not there WOULD in fact be the same level of sexual activity, can be debated. Whatever period in history you are thinking back to, go back even further.
Except you STILL don't understand that fetuses DO have protection in the majority of the world, including the vast majority of the US!
Obviously women do still need them or else they would not get them. My point was that no one is having an abortion for the fun of it. What is yours? You post alot here, but never really provide anything to the discussion. I don't know and I don't care because it is completely irrelevant.
I have answered yours. Now you answer mine. i. Do you approve of forcing a woman to be pregnant against her will? A woman who has expressed no desire to be a mother? ii Is some mystical being in heaven the reason for this?
Every human being has a moral right to their own life and happiness. No one has an obligation to serve "a greater good" or a "duty" to do anything for anyone else. Your life belongs to You, My life belongs to Me and a woman's life belongs to Her. An embryo/a fetus are not physically individuated from the woman carrying it. It is literally part of her body and therefore has no rights. In the earliest stages, this life-form is even more primitive than a friggen frog. Claiming it should have rights is rather insane and claiming abortion is murder is just wrong -- It is nothing even close to murder. FoxHastings (yuuge cred) is actually doing a great job in keeping pointing out the risks of childbirth and health effects of pregnancy (you should keep beating them to the heads with this). I feel this is something that is often being ignored in the debate and mentioned far too seldom by those who are in favour of legal abortions. It goes without saying that the anti-abortionists always completely ignore this and make it seem as if it is the embryo that is suffering as the woman just dances around, swiftly and elegantly like a ballerina for 9 months and then just pushes it out in a second and then goes out to run a marathon. "Just give it away for adoption if you don't want it", they'll say. "The poor fetus is held in there against its will", they'll add. Not to mention that they also leave out the enormous, lifelong responsibility parenthood is. No, they just demand she sacrifices her life and happiness for that which has no rights. They demand the unwillingly pregnant goes through all the pain of pregnancy and childbirth and all the hustle of motherhood against their will "for the greater good". Then they'll claim "We are champions of rights". With all this in mind, it is impossible to present a rational case against abortion. Impossible. Edit no.87: I should really start proof reading before posting.
Nice DODGE! You STILL don't understand that fetuses DO have protection in the majority of the world, including the vast majority of the US!
That due to modern contraception, they don't need to have "abortions for fun on their "Friday-Girls-Night-Outs" which is what you said. However, they will still of course still have abortions, just not "for fun" which I took to mean having LOTS of them. Oh and I suppose you provide PLENTY!
