Brexit - The Center Cannot Hold

From the Economist: The centre cannot hold

The Economist is getting stingy with its graphics, which I am unable to post here. It is nonetheless very explicit about the question of Brexit. That is, in American-ranglish, "somethins' gotta give"!

And it will not be the divisive British attitude towards this question: "Brexit? Yes or No?" - which is 50/50!

Nonetheless this excerpt from the article's text:

And that something, immho, is Mrs. May, who has done her best but should now give up. Her party is so deeply split over this matter that some have even quit. Which is indicative of the fundamental disarray that exists on the Right.

The irony of it all is that the same disarray, though of another sort, exists on the Left in the Labor Party that must d-u-m-p Mr. Corbyn (because he is far, far too Left). He'd make a dreadful head-of-government. But given Mrs. May's track-record, that may be a bit difficult for him to achieve.

(Hear ye, hear ye, hear ye ... ! ;^)

 

I agree Marquis de Lafayette, give up and proceed with a no deal as voted for in the referendum.

 

It wasn't clear in the referendum that a no-deal was the alternative to EU membership. The Leave campaign promised many conflicting things but it rarely suggested that a no-deal was on the cards.

I think that a no-deal Brexit (and all that entails) is inevitable

 

It was, my friend. Leave always meant leaving with a no deal if necessary. Most of us leavers knew how the EU would react so anticipated a no deal scenario.

Or are you saying that if the Remain vote won then we could come out of certain parts of the EU?

 

Then suddenly (surprise, surprise - thank you Brussels' wonks) Project Fear was up and running.

 

There are many ways we can leave the EU without coming out in No Deal. Add to that that who it is going to hurt most is the people who voted leave due to austerity and it is not just an insane choice but an insanely cruel one and one does have to wonder at the motivation of those who support it. It also was not what people voted for. Elite leavers were telling you it would be as easy as pie, they would be begging you for a deal ...or we would have a Norway type deal.

 

Are you sure of the highlighted ? Do you have evidence to support that view ?

You might very well be right, but my impression is that the Leave campaign was a very broad church including those on the left (like Momentum) who absolutely did not want a no-deal, those in the centre who wanted close ties with the EU, those for whom the Leave vote was symptomatic of a broader dissatisfaction with the way things were headed and those who simply wanted better funding for the NHS.

 

I am fortunate to be sad enough to have studied and researched the EU even prior to 2004 so I knew full well what I was voting for. The majority of friends that I spoke to about it were of a similar opinion. Of course, I am sure we could find a 100,000 different reasons that people voted either way. I accept that my use of the term 'most' is an opinion as oppose to a statement of fact.

I do believe ultimately that leave always meant leaving. I would sooner stay all the way in than accept May's deal as it significantly weakens our position across the board but I am unwavering in my support for a no deal Brexit over her deal.

What do you think after the developments of the last few days with Labour backing another vote and Tories threatening to resign with a no deal? In my view, Labour have finally come clean and alienated a lot of their base (the north) and the Tories can survive 15 MPs resigning over a no deal.

 

The EU is a bureaucrats' Utopia - they don't have to work, they are un-elected therefore unaccountable, have non-contributory pension schemes, and the taxpayers pay the non-productive parasites enormous amounts of their money in salaries, expenses, and pensions. Who wouldn't be a bureaucrat?

 

huh. Remember what they promised:

https://www.open-britain.co.uk/remember_what_they_promised_hold_the_government_to_account

https://infacts.org/cut-keep-list-top-19-brexiteer-promises/

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...28/11-brexit-promises-leavers-quietly-dropped

 

Who's that for?

 

3 of the most partisan sites going! Their information is about as useful as the Euro.

 

Is that best you can do? You denying any of that was ever said?

 

Not at all but I, like many, are not dictated to but individual politicians and their own desires. We could also come up with a long list of lies told by the Remain camp. The whole referendum was a joke and I was lucky that I researched the EU far before the referendum was even being discussed.

Half of the list on Guardian article are very dubious to say the least.

 

The Guardian lol - apart from flakes, who the hell takes any notice of the Guardian, never mind believe its links?

 

Occasionally they have something useful to say but the Guardian to the left is the Daily Mail of the right. Extremely partisan.

 

Are you really trying to say that none of those claims were made?



Well done

 

So, where are your sources to back up your claims?

Those things were said and convinced a lot of gullible people.

 

A lot of claims are made by a lot of people everyday. You’re choosing which ones are worthy and which ones aren’t.

 

Show me some that are worthy and backed by a source.

 

Lies from the Remain campaign?

 

First, show me the source(s) from where you gained your information about how the EU works.

One thing at a time. It should be easy for you

 

My sources would be impossible to list as there have been so many over the past 15 years. I am bi-partisan and read a varied amount of articles and books from the left and right, liberal and conservative and decide my own view. Ask me a specific question and I’ll tell you if I know the answer or what I know.

 

Having a deal means "you get your piece of cake AND you eat it".

The no-deal option simply places GB back where it was before "the deal"; that is, entering the EU and not benefiting from its "free-trade clause". That is, import taxation on all good/services sold in the recipient country.

The GB that wants to leave but somehow minimize import duties to the EU is not on. Be prepared to face import duties - which is why more than just a Japanese car-manufacturer will be leaving the UK.

Some people must learn the hard way ...

 

"Norway wealth fund shrugs off Brexit, plans rise in UK investments. OSLO (Reuters) - Norway’s $1 trillion (£753 billion) sovereign wealth fund, the world’s biggest, said on Wednesday it planned to keep increasing its investments in Britain, and it shrugged off uncertainties about Brexit."

It speaks volumes about us when another country has more confidence in us than we have in ourselves?

WE CAN DO IT! Always have, always will. It'll take a little while to settled down but it'll happen. I watched a documentary last night about when we had to leave the ERM - what an unmitigated disaster that was (and how many families lost their homes when mortgage rates soared to 15%??), all because a bunch of Johnny Foreigner bureaucrats told us that we can't do what had to be done in our own interest? If that isn't a valid case for a no-deal withdrawal I don't know what is!

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-...it-plans-rise-in-uk-investments-idUSKCN1QG1RO