Changing China: Xi Jinping's effort to return to socialism

Great news. Xi wants to return to a socialist economy. I suspected that was his aim all along. If it happens we may be able to scratch China from the list of economic adversaries with which we deal. Power and control triumph over economic sanity.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58579831

Thoughts?

 

Scratch them off the list? We're hell-bent on joining them....

 

China never left socialism - they eased the grip for a little while - pulled all the suckers in - and now tightening the grip of both socialism and authoritarianism.

 

They never left authoritrianism. The economic "miracle" was thanks to capitalism.

 

Well there is that.

 

Correct - but they lightened up on authoritarianism and Socialism for a time to attract capitalism - milked it dry - and now this authoritarian Socialist monster has grown really big.

 

I think a socialist economy will cut it down to size if they go that way.

 

There is going to be a shift away from China either way by the West ... EU is a big wildcard - China is like a monster - gobbling up everything in its path - has been making Grandmaster moves on the Economic Chessboard .. while the US has been Blunder Panda .. India - Russia - Brazil - aka "BRICs" is a huge trading block unto itself .. add in the ME - including all the one's we can't do business with. Will be China/Russia rebuilding Syria and Iran .. Got paws all over Africa .. Obviously Venezuela - but numerous other central and South american nations considering "Belt and Road"

Over in the EU -- Italy signed up for Belt and road - Nordstream 2 is comming online - Huwaei is still a going concern -

The Game has gotten very complex - and we keep getting the short end of the stick ... due to stupid leadership ..

 

Honestly I don't think our leadership is stupid. It is corrupt and self serving. It is the voters who are stupid. I would support a complete economic schism with China. I think government should start warning businesses to find cheap labor elsewhere starting right away.

 

Xoe may get us to full socialism before Xi does.

 

Stupid was perhaps not the best term for leadership The decisions appear stupid .. but you are correct that it is due to self serving interests and not stupidity that are the root cause.

The moves on the economic -geopolitical chessboard - from the perspective of the US citizen have been "Stupid" - who knows what motivation the goblins behind the scenes are working.. well .. we do know in some cases .. To feed the Military Industrial Complex - keep that gravy train flowing is one motivation .. and the numerous other gravy trains moving ..

Another is to keep pofits of the international Oligopolies up - outsource manufacturing and fossil fuel production to non industrialized populations - which is what is destroying the planet ..

digressing slightly - In India you got a covid treatment kit - Vitimin D, C .. some other stuff - and "Ivermectin"

India 1.4 Billion people --- 420,000 dead. USA 350 million people . 750,000 dead..

Thats 2100/million people .. vs 300/million peopole .. a 700 percent difference between their "treatment" .. and our "treatment" - which they mistakenly call an vaccine.

 

When government does something right I'm willing to give it credit. I even look for positive things. I don't find them very often. I think the last time I fist pumped a government action was the seal team raid on Bin Laden's compound. That was epic.

 

China has already been moving towards this direction.

This is a long and complicated article, but it shows how China is transforming their capitalist system into a peculiar one with much more Communist-style government control.
http://www.politicalforum.com/index...e-more-control-over-private-companies.580592/

 

I'm tired of the American Left's whitewashing of the great evil that is China.

THE CHINESE COMMUNISTS ARE EVIL

It's not strange. They have bought off our Universities, Fake News Media, Entertainment, Professional Sports, Think Tanks, and Politicians.

Are they our moral equal? The testimony of a former Chinese policeman now living in exile in Europe:

Two Million:

"The CCP now uses Uyghur graduates of those “vocational training centers” to manufacture solar panels–using coal-fired electricity!–that are hailed by Western liberals as morally superior “green” energy sources. The Mainland Chinese have driven most other solar panel manufacturers out of the market, as it is hard to compete on cost with slave labor. Not a single left wing American politician who has let these facts stand in the way of their support for solar energy mandates. By government decree, American taxpayers and ratepayers are supporting slavery in China."

"If there is a single Democrat Party politician who cares about all of this" speak up now.

 

Businesses are smart enough to figure it out on their own. They got the trade agreements back in the 90s through to shift to cheap labor companies back then.
They will figure out to move to the next cheap labor market again.

But US companies did pay a price for cheaper labor and profits, they did lose intellectual properties over the course of the last 30 yrs.

 

I agree. But if China goes socialist, it will happen fast. The businesses will be hurt financially. They can avoid most of that by leaving early.

 

Most smart businesses always have a 2ndary backup plan to keep product flowing.
And they knew all along China is communist. Not socialist.
They know the risk/reward calculation.

 

China has a communist government with a capitalist economy. They are considering moving back to the socialist economy they had back in Mao's day. I hope they do it for our sake.

 

It won't matter for our sake or not.
Our businesses will just move to the next accommodative country. Except we still get to purchase low cost stuff. Which is what us consumers want.

 

You seem not to have read the article. Xi doesn't plan on abandoning Capitalism, any more than we do; he just wants to make it more equitable. So, basically, the Biden tax plan (in a manner of speaking, then, joesnagg was right):

Only it is they, who are following the lead of American Democrats.
But one-Party China doesn't have to fight Republicans, to get anything done, so I wonder if they'll actually get it done, first.

<SNIP from your link>

Under this banner, targeting tax evasion by the wealthy makes more sense, as do moves to make education more equitable by banning private tutoring companies. The ongoing crackdown on the country's tech giants can also be seen as part of the plan.

<End Snip>

But it's not just Dems who've inspired Xi; there are also echoes of some of our good ol' culture wars, coming more so from the conservative direction, that is, more reminiscent of the Republican side of it:

<Snip>

The thing is that - along with the wealth redistribution aspects of the communist path - Mr Xi also seems to believe that this means thrusting the Party back into most aspects of daily life, as the only realistic way of achieving what needs to be done.

Kids are being lazy, wasting away their youth playing video games? Party to the rescue: three-hour gaming limit.

Teenagers having their minds poisoned with silly, idol-worshipping television? Party to the rescue: "sissy looking" boys banned from programmes.

Demographic time bomb ticking: Again, the Party has the solution: Three-child policy for all!

Football, cinema, music, philosophy, babies, language, science… the PARTY has the answers.

<End Snip>

 

What do you mean "goes socialism?"

They are communist. Socialism would be a step in the right direction.

 

I don't see much evidence of socialism. I would say it's top-down capitalism. They want to allow as much capitalism possible, however they won't allow individuals, companies, institutions or ideologies to overshadow the CCP (communist in name only).

 

No evidence of State Control of resources and means of production .. none at all -- ? Our definitions of socialism must differ.

 

Nobody who is even slightly acquainted with what happened in India believes the actual COVID deaths were anything close to 420,000 or actual COVID cases anywhere close to the official figures. Nation wide testing programs have consistently shown the actual figure for COVID infections is likely 70% of the population - 25 to 30 times the official figure. Similarly, figures for excess deaths for the period of the epidemic are around 5 million.

Most Indians who died of COVID died outside official medical care and the cause of death went unrecorded. In India's largest state (over 200 million people) the Chief Minister suppressed data on how bad the epidemic was. So, there isn't any guarantee that the figures even cover all deaths in hospital from COVID. They have nothing to do with reality & people should stop using them.

Half the people I work with are recent immigrants from India. They all have family members in India and several have family members who were very ill or even died. These were people with the resources & contacts to get healthcare, but it wasn't available. People died in their homes & died in the streets. The idea that vitamin D or ivermectin somehow kept India's death toll below America's is pure fantasy.

Oh, and while I'm at it, a Russian official accidentally let it slip that Russia's official figures are about a third of the actual figures. I am betting that there are dozens of nations where the actual figures are well above the official ones. Most African nations have even worse health infrastructure than India, so any official figure should be assumed to be an undercount.

 

Xi has a problem. Ever since Deng reformed the Chinese economy & moved it from a Socialist command economy to a 'mixed economy' (basically what Western nations have) the deal with China's people has been prosperity in return for political passivity. In truth the people have never been as passive as it might appear from the outside, but they have largely been prepared to 'go along to get along' and provide better opportunities for their children.

If Xi is going to take that reward away he is going to risk considerable internal unrest. He is also going to risk China's ability to grow either its 'hard' or 'soft' power enough to keep challenging the nations lining up against it. Appeals to nationalism might patch a few cracks at home, but only for so long. If Xi really is ditching capitalism (and I'm not convinced yet) it will make China more dangerous in the short term.

It will mean America needs to engage with the nations on China's periphery more deeply than it has been for a few years. The early signs under Biden are positive, with the strengthening of 'the Quad', AUKUS and strengthening of bilateral ties, but more is needed. China has just applied to join the TPP, which Trump withdrew from in 2017. Biden needs to negotiate a re-entry to that body tha tsatisfies his own party & the other TPP members. That will be one way to re-assert US leadership in the Pacific, but there are plenty of others.