If Blacks are less intelligent what should we do?

LOL.
The usual Ejay. 100% Joseph Graves claims..
and claiming he/his link "proves" or "refutes" anything.
Goofy Graves is a Black American 'scientist' who, like You, is determined to say there's no race. That's it. That's all.

ALL Evidence points to Racial difference in IQ. ALL of it.
On the other side there is only apologism trying to explain/Rationalize WHY.

In Fact, my unwitting 'opponent' :^), YOU have made hundreds of posts containing such difference, including Citing (YOUR other two Pillars/ Horse-and-ponies) Nisbett citing Wicherts claiming sub-Saharan IQ was not really 70, but 80!
http://www.debatepolitics.com/scien...argely-genetic-w-957-a-56.html#post1060497911 On Many other boards besides the above.
And those are YOUR guys!

As to Testosterone, there are differing opinions but only one not only explains Crime, but Athletic ability, and Prostate Cancer rates. (and Noise in the movie theater and on the sidewalk).

Black Males and Testosterone: Evolution and Perspectives | Beyond Highbrow – Robert Lindsay

Thus, who IS in Jail.
See also the less controversial studies:
Serum testosterone levels in healthy young black and white men.
Serum testosterone levels in healthy youn... [J Natl Cancer Inst. 1986] - PubMed - NCBI

Racial/ethnic variations in male testosterone levels: a probable contributor to Group Differences in health.
Racial/ethnic Variations in male testosterone level... [Steroids. 1992] - PubMed - NCBI

ScienceDirect.com - Personality and Individual Differences - Testosterone, crime, and misbehavior among 692 male prison inmates
ScienceDirect.com - Personality and Individual Differences - Testosterone, crime, and misbehavior among 692 male prison inmates​

There Are studies which Disagree, but that is not "refutation", especially in light of the fact Blacks Do have Twice the Prostate cancer rate, which has a direct correlation with that Higher Testosterone. Androgen Receptors as well as the hormone itself, are a factor.

So you have a kind of natural Roid Rage/High-T.
Lower IQ and Higher testosterone - Dangerous combo.
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I don't think you ever suggested your policy for subspecies of humans that are less than the superior subspecies. Is deportation an option? What do you do about these people? If we know they are substandard, is not the next logical step figuring out how to get rid of them?

 

Your usual insinuation, with NO rebuttal.
As has been concluded many times previous: as with any problem, first it has to be identified, and generally agreed on.
Only then can we deal with the solutions, if any.
We've been there already - you and I - on This topic, and you failed to get me to ascent to Your Racist 'solutions.'
Now go back to Yelling or insinuating "Genocide", "Racist", "Nazi"; your ONLY and trite purpose in this section.
Bye.
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I never mentioned that you said we should treat individuals differently. My claim was against rayznack and Gatewood.

As for the strawman claim, if you refuse to let an individual immigrate because they belong to a particular group, you are treating that individual differently than a individual from another group, so no, that's not a strawman, just basic logic.

 

@Taxonomy26

Your post is complete garbage. Calling Graves a silly Black American 'scientist' (in parentheses because you don't want to give a biologist credit for being an actual scientist) does not dispute his credibility as a scientist. Go ahead and try to construct a coherent argument for why Joseph Graves should not be regarded as a credible scientist. His academic credentials are there for everyone to see so do explain why he is not credible other than saying he is Black and says that there are no biological races (a view held by many scientists in relevant fields).

Academic credentials of Joseph Graves

You didn't actually address Graves arguments you simply resorted to Ad Hominem attacks to discredit him. Since you don't want to address his arguments and pretend that he has no credibility I am going to post the full content here and summarize what he said.

So Graves explained clearly that your argument is invalid for the following reasons:

1. The studies you cite use socially-defined racial categories to make inferences about biological differences in testosterone.

2. Environmental factors affect testosterone levels so this trait can not be compared between groups to establish genetic differences.

3. He provided a counter study that shows that age and Body Mass Index (BMI) affect testosterone levels and that there is no racial difference when these factors are controlled.

What is your counter to these arguments? Nothing! You also cited the very same study that Graves critiqued in detail and showed was invalid not to mention citing the blog entry of a White Supremacist to support your arguments. Remind me again, what scientific credentials Robert Lindsay has?

Nisbett and Wicherts maintain that the cause of the Black-White IQ gap and racial IQ gaps in general is environmental. So why are you harping on about them saying that the Black African IQ average is 80 (actually 82)? You are attacking a strawman. Wicherts point is that Lynn and others underestimate the IQ of Africans with flawed research methodologies. You call debates about the cause of the racial IQ gaps apologism but these are legitimate scientific analyses of the cause and they point to environment as the sole factor with no genetic component to speak of. That is not an insignificant finding, it is fundamentally different from your view. In addition to pointing out the unscientific nature of arguments such as yours Graves also pointed out the absurdity of arguing that Blacks are more violent than other races because of innate biological differences, an idea which is easily dispelled when you look at the historical record of atrocities (crimes against humanity) committed by both Whites and Asians.

Do you have a logical scientific argument for why we should dismiss atrocities of White Americans against Blacks from Africa that they enslaved or Japanese soldiers raping and pillaging across Asia? Is that not aggressive behavior? These actions are aggressive behavior which involve the same types of violence (e.g. rape, beating, murder etc.) that Blacks are being put in prison for today. These men were not being arrested and convicted for these crimes because it was considered socially acceptable by their culture but the behavior is the same so explain why these actions are not relevant to the claims you are making about racial differences in aggression and violent behavior. Truthfully you can't without adhering to racist ideology but don't say I didn't give you the chance to explain views.

 

You want to compare Blacks murdering and raping each other and everybody else every day with historically dubious accounts from an active international warzone?

 

Just to Reiterate:
NONE of my points were touched.

Untouched, in Fact Unwittingly admitted.
We have an IQ problem here.
I accuse you of using Graves and just about Only Graves..
You put up Graves' Opinion in response! WTF!
It's like arguing with a Creationist who claims there's a god, and when you ask for Objective evidence .. he puts up more of the Bible.
You use Graves Opinion SCRIPTURALLY and insist this is "proof" or "refutation."
You don't understand debate/science at all.
THAT is The IQ problem right here in River City.

Again, this remains untouched. ALL evidence points to Racial difference in IQ, with some disagreeing by how Much and "why."

AS well as putting up 3 excellently sourced studies, I noted difference of opinion. But unlike you showed Common Sense in pointing out Testosterone difference explains Higher Prostate Cancer, Athletic ability, and aggression/Crime.
I also noted it was NOT Testosterone alone, but Androgen Receptors.

Here again we have an IQ problem. Comical.
Argument by Anecdote, (as well as non-analogous events/Political War) as opposed to the Stats about people living within the SAME society.
Hark!
Not to mention so many genocides in Intra-Black-Africa as not to be countable. Because OF IQ/never exceeding local tribalism, they just didn't have the Tools to travel to or wage war on anyone outside, and make (or record) more notably historic ones. As opposed to Smarter and more advanced 'White' and Asian societies who found and colonialized THEM.

So to summarize: we have someone who not only can't debate logically, but when accused of using Graves almost exclusively/scripturally .... uses Graves in response! AND... Self-servingly/Goofily confuses that 'Difference of Opinion' with "refutation" and scientifically non-existant "proof."
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I refuted your contention that there are genetically determined racial differences in testosterone level and that we can effectively measure and compare this trait between groups. You have no rebuttal.

You are the one with an IQ problem. You are ignoring Graves arguments and simply repeating your discredited opinion.

No one disputes the IQ difference, only the cause. You have built a strawman, knocked it down and then pretended to refute an argument your opponent never made.

You cited the opinion of a White Supremacist on Androgen Receptors not an actual study and one of the studies you cited was reviewed and critiqued in detail by Graves.

You also have no rebuttal to the counter study he cited.

This is not a rebuttal to the argument. You are simply pointing fingers and saying, "What about undocumented genocides in Africa?"

My question to you is if Whites and Asians are less violent than Blacks how do you explain historical atrocities committed by their societies? And while we are on that subject how are these atrocities not relevant to the behavior of Whites and Asians when the same type of acts are being committed? We know these crimes were committed so how are stats being compared within the same society more relevant than documented historical atrocities? My argument is that because there is a correlation between poverty and crime the disproportionate Black crime rate is caused by environmental effects on behavior (e.g. Blacks are disproportionately poor because of racist discrimination therefore they are motivated to commit more crime) rather than biological differences between races. You have not challenged that position only appeal to ridiculous arguments about Blacks being more aggressive because of higher testosterone which apparently causes them to commit more violent crime and yell at the screen in movie theaters. You are essentially promoting the idea that racist stereotypes have a genetic basis which is a racist and unsubstantiated argument. Your defense of this position is unscientific and nothing by adherence to racist ideology instead of science.

Black people are not innately stupid and violent. There is no scientific basis for making that claim. As far as Black Africans being supposedly primitive and less intelligent is concerned that idea has also been refuted.

Exhibit A:

One more thing...any reasonably intelligent person can see that you are projecting your insecurities with all of this nonsense about me lacking debate skills. I suggest that you work on sharpening your own skills instead of insulting your opponents because they clearly need work. Ignoring arguments, name-calling and committing logical fallacies are the trademarks of someone who doesn't know what they are talking about.

 

How do you know it's not Mediterranean genes in Europeans which account for European barbarity?

England's the most Mediterranean in Northern Europe according to this DNA study, and Estonians the least.

 

Continental ancestry has nothing to do with aggressive behavior. As humans we have as much capacity for evil as good.

 

There seems to be 2 European strains linked to more barbaric behavior being the Mediterranean influx, and also the Finno-Ugric influx.

Nations like Poland, Belarussians,,Swedish, Irish, Czechs, Norwegians, are examples of Europeans who lack both Mediterranean, or Finno-Ugric DNA, and their morality has been beyond that of much of Europe.

 

So what's your evidence that racial groups have the same crime rates after adjusting for household income?

 

Again, you are a very confused Boy.
Finding an article or study DISAGREEING is not "refuting". Not again!
Anyone can google a Yes or no to Any Premise.
Got it?
As to me having No rebuttal?
LOFL Goofy.
How about something more Recent, incorporating many other recent studies.
see below:

Testosterone, Race, and Crime
April 15, 2016
http://thealternativehypothesis.org/index.php/2016/04/15/testosterone-race-and-crime/

Oucher!
I guess they're all "racists".

It was remarkable to see what a drone you are. Even after I accused you of being a one trick pony.. you d!d !t aga!n. It's positively Pavlovian.. or OCD.
Though I see Forced you to finally scrape up another source...
Laughable as IT is too!

You must have missed the last few pages of this string.
But wait, YOU acknowledge this IQ Gap.. between WHO exactly? Ooops.

Again this is NOT analogous. It is either Disingenuous or Dishonest deflection.
We are talking about Violence within the SAME society/conditions. (Here, London, etc)

GREAT, you finally cite something beside Graves and it's "Africanist Archaeology".
http://safa.rice.edu/About_SAfA/
Clown City!
IOW, the Afro-Studies dept that claim sub-Saharans/'Blacks' built the Pyramids, etc, etc, etc.
So your "exhibit A" is "A" as in "A"fro.

One more simple answer.
ALL evidence both here and in Africa say Black IQ IS Lower and Crime IS Higher.
(Despite your 'violence' deflection of World Wars, which blacks won't have been technically capable of for another 50,000 years)

Second more thing:
Blacks would still be living in huts and throwing spears were it not for the West.. and they still are to good extent.
Half the continent would have been wiped out by Famine, AIDS, Ebola, etc, because Africans were going Nowhere and are nowhere.
And in the USA it's similar/Consistent.
Higher Crime, Lower IQ.
Asians: the Reverse!

You try to bury the simple and obvious truth getting lost in selecta-science and can't really debate anything with hard numbers, nor admit the obvious.
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Using Germans as a proxy would suggest that under the same circumstances Polish have a 4 point higher IQ than Germans.

Communist East Germany had scored a 95 IQ vs a 99 IQ for Communist Poland.

German Americans had scored a 105 IQ vs a 109 IQ for Polish Americans.

Gee, maybe Ashkenazi Jewish IQ's are also inflated in the West?

The IQ of Israel is 95, and estimated 103 for Ashkenazi Jews in Israel.
(That's quite lower than the 107 - 115 IQ score for Ashkenazi Jews in America)

How come?

Could it be that Ashkenazi Jews in America are more likely to be the elite, while Ashkenazi Jews in Israel are more likely to be low-end fundamentalist Jews?

 

You're responding to a post many pages/days/weeks/I-dunno back?
This is such Gibrish.. where can one start.
National IQ is valid only if one examines the genetic groups within.
"polish," "German," etc are fairly meaningless.
How about Prussian, Bavarian, Alsation, or Danzigian IQ?

You're obsessed your little Polak IQ and have posted micro-stats from '1970s polish immigrants' just to flatter it.
These strings are about Race and IQ.
If you want to talk National IQs one has to analyze the Ethnic/Genetic stains, not political names within.
Maybe Germans have more Ashkenazi Jew? Who knows.
Now move along little xenophobe.
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I'm currently searching through racial threads here, to find an article about lower T3 levels in African Americans vs White Americans that I posted, but can't seem to find in Google, or Bing as we speak.
(Which would be more evidence of the inherently lower IQ's in Blacks, as T3 levels correlate with cognitive ability)

I saw this post, and simply decided to respond.

How do you know that it's not the opposite?

That Ashkenazi Jews score a higher IQ than Sephardi Jews due to mixing with Polish, Germans, Hungarians, and so forth?

It's mighty funny that you boast of the "Ethnic American Ashkenazi Jewish IQ" but then condemn me for boasting of the "Ethnic American Polish IQ"

 

Except that's Not True.
The VAST VAST VAST Majority of the time, in fact, I stick with Black/American-Black/White/Asian, not Jewish at all, and Almost never "Ethnic American Ashkenazi Jewish IQ"! Once in a blue moon that might come up. (IF at all) (unlike for you, Polak IQ is a daily pursuit.)
That's just a plain Polak Lie.
Make my day.
Google
No results found for "Ethnic American Ashkenazi Jewish IQ" "taxonomy26"
No results found for "American Ashkenazi Jewish IQ" "taxonomy26"

Oh and you did NOT answer on this goofy Parsing of National IQ issue I busted with Prussian/Alsation/Bavarian, etc.
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I've seen you boast of the IQ of Ashkenazi Jewish Americans, so what's wrong with me boasting of the IQ of Polish Americans?

 

My answer is above my little Polish Flag waver.
I rarely use Jews, much less "Ethnic American Ashkenazi Jews" IF AT ALL.
YOU LIED.
While you try and Shoehorn Polaks into the debate daily.
Of course, even if I, or anyone else, used Ashkenazi Jews, it would be valid as they ARE an identifiable Genetic group, unlike Poles, who are a Political group.
You Got Exposed and Crushed-ski.
Bye Polak. (and take your lightbulbs with you)
Another Polak last-word lie to follow, but he got gutted. (and STILL didn't answer me on the silliness of National IQ in #695)
Bye.
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The genetics of Polish differ from many other Europeans too, to the West of Poland there's a genetic divide with Western Europeans having less Baltic DNA, and less R1a haplogroup, and more Atlantic DNA, and more R1b haplogroup, while to the North, and North-East of Poland there's more Finno-Ugric DNA, linked to haplogroup N, and to the South of Poland there's more Mediterranean DNA.

But, it's not so surprising that Polish might score higher IQ's than Western Europeans under equalized circumstances.

Polish, like other Eastern Europeans tend to have wider, and taller brains, which are more advanced.

The brains of Humans have become wider, and taller since Human evolution had begun.

The brains of Africans, and Australoids are indeed thinner, and shorter than Eurasians.

 

Europeans come up with an intelligence test that says that blacks are less intelligent than whites.

shocked, shocked I am.

let me know when the UN comes up with a fair test for evaluating people's natural level of intelligence, one that takes into account discrepencies in educational opportunities, environmental stress factors like depression & poverty, and THEN maybe I'll be interested.

 

What about the Jewish Psychologist William Stern who founded the concept of an IQ?

 

That would be the Same test that Asians score higher than Euros on.

There are already Many tests that adjust for socioeconomic, cultural, lingual, etc. ie, Some are all visual.

Of course Polak found a JOOO to Blame for the start of the 'Conspiracy', without even addressing Ronstar's point.
(what we expect from Polak)
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poverty can have deep and lasting effects on one's emotional state, as can living in a single-parent home and witnessing abuse.

how do IQ tests adjust for that?

 

I understand you missed several strings on this, but the great equalizer is Trans-Racial adoption studies. The Three way pattern remains after adoption by White Middle Class parents.
see:
Race differences in average IQ are largely genetic
http://www.news-medical.net/news/2005/04/26/Race-differences-in-average-IQ-are-largely-genetic.aspx
"...Race differences show up by 3 years of age, even after matching on maternal education and other variables"..

Don't you think IQ researchers are aware of the variables?
Do you think they are all White Supremacists?
Even the PC APA and others admit the difference Cannot all be accounted for by socioeconomic factors. Altho they dared not tread into genetic.
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