The ark and a world wide flood.

Gorn Captain-

Okay, so if there can be error in the Bible.....then there could be errors in the account of Jesus' life, his death, and....supposed Resurrection....couldn't there?

What happens to Christianity....if the story of the Resurrection is in error?

 

It dismantles. The resurrection is the crux (bad pun intended) of Christianity. It'll be like proving to an atheist that God exist.

 

Getting back to the flood. If all the earth was covered with water for 40 days and 40 nights before the water could even recede, which would even take a whole lot longer. All the plant life on earth which needs photosynthesis to survive would die off. All the trees and plants would be miles under water where no light could reach them.

 

There's enough similarity between the Babylonian flood myth and Noah's story to conclude that Genesis copied the story.

 

First place it rained 40 days and nights, the flood lasted for a year. Second, the water wasn't miles deep. It covered the highest mountain (which wasn't that tall then) by 15 cubits. And third, plant life could survive by many ways:

Log mats

Floating seeds

Being uprooted and replanted

Not being covered by water for the entire flood due to the shifting of the earth.

- - - Updated - - -

Or vice versa.

 

Exactly....that's why you are a Literalist. You cannot accept any "grey area" in the Bible.

If Genesis (6 day creation 6000 years ago, Noah's Flood, etc.) isn't true....you worry that the Gospels might not be true, too.

However, many Christians CAN accept the OT as mythology, and the NT as historical (or mostly historical).


But it puts you in a box....defending things that are clearly illogical....because myths aren't logical.

God created the Earth and stars 6000 years ago????....but we can see stars MORE than 6000 light-years away.

God created the plants...BEFORE He created the Sun???? (Genesis 1:11, 1:14)....so the plants would have died from interstellar cold freezing them in a few seconds.

An 800 foot long boat could hold hundreds of animals????....be serviced by only 8 people....and contain enough food and hay (for waste) to survive for a year at sea?

The Sun stopped in the sky for a day????.....but NO OTHER culture on the planet happened to notice, but the Hebrews???

 

Literalist drive people away from Christianity.......

 

It says in the Bible that god strecthed out the heavens. So the question is not "how did the light get from there to here?" The question should be "how did the star get from here to there?"

Doesn't the earth have a hot mantle? Besides there was light before the sun.

Yes, an 800 foot (actually 500) can hold hundreds and even thousands of sheep sized animals especially if they were babies or juveniles. As for food, farmers today would set a hay bale or two out in the field and the animals would feed themselves. As for waste, for one if they were babies or juveniles then they would eat and waste a whole lot less than adults. Also many animals hibernate and recycle there waste during rough weather.

Actually many other cultures noticed.

http://creation.mobi/joshuas-long-day

 

It's not "or vice versa." Christians always think so, but not one scholar does. There are many anachronisms in the Genesis text, which clearly suggests that Genesis was written after the Enuma Elish, most likely during the 5-6th century BC.

You know, during the Babylonian Exile.

It fits.

Even the Catholic Church agrees that Genesis largely copied the Enuma Elish. Pope Benedict XVI's A Catholic Understanding of the Creation and the Fall is a recommended read.

 

Nope. The Genesis story is original.

http://creation.mobi/is-genesis-1-just-reworked-babylonian-myth

 

You can't quote Christian propaganda at me! That's like letting a murderer free because the murderer says he's innocent. Every scholar in the world claims that Enuma Elish predates Genesis by centuries.

I clicked on your link, however, and I had to quit reading by the time I got to the part where the author alleges that there are no similarities between Genesis and Enuma Elish. (If you'd like, I can show you passages that are plagiarized.) The article is clearly written to support Christian belief in the flood. A non-Christian can't read that with a straight face anymore than you'd read a Scientology blog about their version of history that contradicts the mainstream with a straight face.

Your opinion is outside of the mainstream. It's simple fact Genesis was written centuries after Enuma Elish. Maybe you should research a bit on it, if you're brave enough to challenge your worldview.

 

Really? EVERYONE? And did you even read the article?

Wait a minute, you skimmed over the main part of the article that shows why they are not similar? That's me saying that I skimmed over the part of an article that proved the earth is old.

The mainstream once though big rocks falls faster than little rocks. The mainstream once thought that if you're sick you have bad blood so they drained it out. The mainstream once believed (and still do) in spontaneous generation.

 

The Mainstream ONCE thought what was written in the Bible was all facts.

Then they grew up and realized like any Fable, Fairy Tale or Children's Story...that it was designed to teach a MORAL LESSON as this is when they realized that the Bible was NOT a book of Historical Facts but a book of STORIES.

AA

 

Have you ever heard of panbabylonism? It's what mainstream, serious scholars adhere to:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panbabylonism

Scholars aren't trying to "hide the truth" about Jesus. They're seekers of truth, and sometimes truth contradicts your religion. That's unfortunate for you, but knowledge and progress can't be halted for the religious.

If you go to the part of that wikipedia article that talks about the Genesis flood, a side-by-side comparison is made with the Enuma Elish. It's clear that Genesis is a copy of the Enuma Elish.

Maybe you should look for a new religion if your current one can't endure scrutiny. Honestly, if believing in your religion requires you to accuse biologists and geologists and scholars and archaeologists of "conspiring against God" or whatever, then it probably means that your religion is junk.

 

I said it would take a whole lot longer for the water to recede. I myself believe a flood of that proportion would take a lot longer than a year Let's just go with your time line, a year and forty days.

Everest was around then and Everest is 24,870 ft. That's more than 4 miles up.

Seeds need nutrients to survive. A floating log that has been waterlogged for over a year cannot support any seed or plant. Plants and even small trees can grow on logs that are stationary, in shallow water and have access to nutrients. These nutrients usually occur because the log is still attached to the soil. Go to a deep lake and see if you can find a plant or tree growing out of a log that is in the middle of the lake.

Any seeds that do germinate in water can only last for a short time. Usually no more than a couple of days.

Uprooted from where. Miles below the floodline. The pressure would kill human life. Where are they being replanted. The whole world is covered in water remember.

This shift would sure to cause some major Tsunamis or tidal waves. A small delicate plant would not survive it.


Let's say for argument's sake that a single plant or even a few hundred plants survived on water soaked logs floating in deep water for over a year. There are literally hundreds of thousands of different species of fauna in the world. Unless you're a firm believer of evolution there is no way today's plant life could have come from a worldwide flood. The evolution process takes a very long time. What I just described is actually impossible.

 

"The Bible is the word of God"
"How can you be sure it's the word of God?"
"Because the Bible tells us so"
"Why believe the Bible?
"The Bible is infallible"
"How do you know it's infallible?"
(return to top)

 

LOLOLOL

 

There is plenty of geological evidence supporting a flood in the time of Noah, not only that but numerous floods that have been documented in other cultures and religions...

Any geologist would tell you this...

IMO, the issue isn't the floods themselves but what caused the floods..

 

How is that any different than "AGW exists just because people I trust tell me it is science fact?"

Both AGW and religion require faith..

So if you want to talk about how faith is only for the stupid then I suppose we're all a bunch of retards because we all have faith in something or another.

 

Yes, seeing how floods are natural occurrences its not surprising that there is evidence of floods from 4500 years ago, just like 450,000 years ago and 4,500,000 years ago and 45 days ago.

There are all kinds of causation for flooding, but apart from religious mythology, there isn't any need for the hand of god explanation.

 

Nice bit of sophistry there.

Equating religious faith with AGW. But then again I can see how some people might think that religious faith requiring absolutely no concrete evidence to support its assertions is the same thing as "faith" in science and varying interpretations of observable processes and data.

 

Except that China, Anatolia, Egypt, the Arabian Peninsula were never flooded.. .. neither was Palestine and the Levant. Any Geologist would tell you that..

Flood myths from Sumer show up in Dilmun long before Abraham.

 

What was the light source before the sun? I notice that when the sun sets it gets pretty darn dark - especially when the moon isn't reflecting THE SUN!

Also, the notion of 40 days of rain of any significant depth would be PURE magic, as the heat equations for condensing that amount of water vapor just aren't going to work out.

Plus, one must then explain the water going somewhere in short order.

 

The Rain Drained to the Great Fresh Water, Black Lake, Valley
if not the whole Mediterranean valley beyond the Pillars of Hercules.
The confluence of 4 rivers, the location of Edan became the Persian Gulf.
And sometimes, stuff just sinks into the water such as Atlantis, Alexandria, Port Royal.

Maybe 40 days or whatever true elongated spread as 40 is such a trite number in the Bible,
was some volcanic "nuclear winter" and its' effect on precipitation.
Y'think
And Concurrent to the Great Ice Sheets Melting . . . what a story.

PeopleKind just don't make this stuff up!
Great Floods Happen!​

Moi

r > g

View attachment 41836

Across an immense, unguarded, ethereal border, Canadians, cool and unsympathetic,
regard our America with envious eyes and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.​

 

The issue isn't floods. We all know they happened. The issue is a worldwide flood the covered the entire earth. The story that is in the bible.