Thailand - Renewables and EV Mecca

Thailand has been adding more and more renewable energy to their mix. In addition, they are the Southeast Asia leader in EV sales.

This floating hydro solar hybrid power plant is the largest of it's kind in the world.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021...r-venture-could-shape-the-future-of-thailand/



Thailand also leads all Southeast Asia countries in sales of EVs.

Thailand EV sales in 2023 went up 684% vs 2022, now 12% of total new car sales – BYD top, Neta second

https://paultan.org/2024/01/09/thai...2-of-total-new-car-sales-byd-top-neta-second/

With the aforementioned total EV registrations of 76,314 units in Thailand last year, this accounted for 12.02% of the total registrations in 2023 in the country, which was 634,948 units overall. For comparison to EV sales in Thailand in past years, 9,729 EVs were sold in 2022, 1,935 EVs were sold in 2021, and 1,056 EVs were sold in 2020, reported Autolife Thailand.

 

Impressive 1!!

 

Yeah, I hadn't known that there are solar farms over bodies of water.

 

Also, looking at that photo, those panels reflect a lot of sunlight, and keep the heat from being absorbed by the water. Thailand has a very hot year-round climate, so cooler water is probably very desirable. Cooler water is very important for a lot of other energy considerations. For example evaporative coolers and cooling towers and for large scale refrigeration (food storage, etc.). These processes are much more efficient with cooler water.

Solar panels over water may not work as well in cooler climates. The water would probably stay frozen for longer timeframes in the Winter.

 

But for hot climate areas it is brilliant.

 

Looks like just the opposite when we look at evidence produced through application of the scientific method.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10201-022-00698-y

There’s a lot yet to learn about temps around solar farms. There’s a lot of heterogeneity in study results, most likely because there are so many different types of installations in so many different environments (different native vegetation, urban vs rural, etc.).

Large scale installations in deserts etc. seem to show a local cooling effect. Installation in urban areas shows a heating effect.

https://physicsworld.com/a/solar-pa...-urban-environment-systematic-review-reveals/

 

Who knew? Solar panels contribute to global warming. Oops.

 

Regarding the floating solar panels, it sounds like the verdict is still out. The Singapore study says a 0.3 deg C increase - that's a very slight increase for water temperatures. It did say that Singapore was a shallow water body. Elsewhere in the article, it says that they expect a cooling.

The surface water temperature is expected to decrease due to shading of PV panels, although the water surface also can be warmed by thermal radiation from the panels and the reduction of evaporative heat flux at the water surface.

Regarding a heating effect of solar panels in an urban environment. The study is a little bizarre. They say:

It’s important to put all of my discussion on this topic in the context that it depends on what you’re comparing a particular application to. So, the example would be if you put PVs on an existing black roof, you’re not having as much of an adverse effect on the urban thermal environment as if you put those PVs on a white roof, because a white roof would normally be a relatively cool surface.

Nobody has a white roof, and most roofs tend to be darker in color. I have solar panels, and there is definitely reflection off solar panels - even with anti-reflective coatings.. You can visibly see it reflect, similar to glass. I think solar panels reflect more than most roofs. Turns out that, in most cases, my assessment is correct ---

Since most solar panels are roof-mounted, and most roofs are covered in dark tar paper shingles, covering the roof with solar panels may actually represent a positive change in reflectivity.

https://www.treehugger.com/ask-pablo-do-solar-panels-actually-contribute-to-climate-change-4857452

 

0.3 degrees C is 30% of the total global warming in the modern warm period which began in the mis 1800’s.

 

Sheesh... It's not like reservoir solar panels are a global phenomenon. Most of this discussion was about the local water and the effects of floating panels. But you want to turn the discussion into some sort of asphalt heat-absorbing monstrosity.

 

Oh. So you aren’t familiar with published research. Your pull quote is from the introduction section of the paper. The introduction section provides context for and an explanation of what questions the study aims to answer. In this case, the researchers expected cooling as you did based on shading. You left out the next sentence in your introduction pull quote. It says

The question this study aims to address is what is the net result of the competing mechanisms, shading vs. thermal radiation and evaporative heat flux.

When reading studies, the takeaway is in the results section. That’s where the answers are to be found. Not in the hypothesizing of the introduction section. Let’s look at the results.

What study is bizarre? The systematic review referenced by me examines the results of 116 studies of solar panel’s effect on surrounding environments.

Your blogger does not cite any research. It’s an opinion piece. So we have your opinion and that of a blogger vs results of 116 formal research papers. Hmmm.

Did you notice the phrase “if you put PVs on an existing black roof, you’re not having as much adverse effect in the urban thermal environment as if you put those PVs on a white roof,”?

The point is there is added warming EVEN ON BLACK ROOFS. Thus there is warming on ALL roofs of every color.

California mandates white roofs on commercial buildings.

“Nobody” lives in these houses.






I’m a bit of an outlier, but I’m going to continue going with RESULTS of peer reviewed research over unsubstantiated opinions.

 

And yet you dismiss the temperature increase. Global warming is not a global phenomenon as well. Antarctica shows this.

BTW if you want to experience what 1 - 3 degrees C of global warming feels like go and live in a condo in the middle of a large city.

 

Things aren’t as simple and binary as folks are led to believe.

 

I disagree with your interpretation of these sentences. I think they're worded poorly. And I agree with Tree Hugger that there is more reflectivity from panels than a dark roof. I own solar panels - definitely more reflectivity.

Even with white roofs, in retrospect to "the big picture", the entire article is blowing things out of proportion, considering you have asphalt roads and parking lots just sucking up heat in urban areas. What is the net effect of solar panels in relation to this? ---- .000000001% ?

 

Your opinions are noted. I’m going with the 116 studies.

We can’t deny science we don’t like and retain credibility.

 

In this case, I have first hand experience. If you read about solar panel reflectivity, that's considered a negative. The object of solar panels is to absorb as much of the sun as possible. Tracking systems have much less reflectvity. Roof mount systems are often reflecting light. You can look at most pictures of rooftop solar and visibly see the reflection. Makes me wonder about the studies, and what they were analyzing. Tracking systems are mostly used by large-scale Utilities. I asked for a quote recently, and the installer told me they no longer quote them for residential.

Solar panels are a lot like glass. If the sun shines directly at glass, most of the energy will pass through. If the sun shines on an angle at glass, much of the light will be reflected.

 

You don’t have to wonder. The studies are very clear.

You are assuming you can observe all wavelengths. The wavelengths of light NOT reflected heat the panels because the panels cannot turn all the energy absorbed into electricity.

I could say that because my plants sequester carbon there is no CO2 driven AGW. I have experience taking carbon out of the atmosphere, therefore it’s not a problem. I observe CO2 being converted to soil organic matter so all studies showing excess CO2 still exists can be ignored.

Again, your opinions are noted. I’m uninterested in opinions. I prefer evidence produced through application of the scientific method.

 

But glass isn't, not when angled.

 

It better be or you aren’t generating electricity.

Here are the specs for the wavelengths that “go through” solar panel glass.


Here is the spectrum actually used to generate electricity.

So we have wavelength above 750 nm doing nothing but generating heat.

If your panels are reflecting much visible light they are not being efficient at generating electricity. It’s kind of pointless to reflect light away from a solar cell.

 

How long up have I been saying that Asia will lead the EV revolution? ICEs are choking Asian cities and Asians in general have a different outlook on transportation - if it gets you from point a to point b cheaply they want it. I am not talking top 1% but general population. With the grid - they don’t have infrastructure to replace and solar is easier to scale up than fossil fuels so I am not surprised there either. Interesting that they are investing in floating EV arrays - that seems to be a coming “thing”

 

Yeah! Take it from me - they are working on it! Several attempts at “solar paint”. What we are using now is not what we will be using in 10 years time

 

Exactly! And that's why I mentioned that reflectivity is undesirable. However, realistically, unless you have trackers, reflecting is a fact of life. The spectral transmittance curve is undoubtedly for deirect 90 degree sunlight, which will typically only occur twice a year for a 2-3 week period, and only during certain hours of those days. Any other time reflectance. Now do you see why I question the study? White roof - I wholeheartedly agree, but anything else - not so much.

 

Wut??? Let me guess conspiracy theory No 991?

 

China also has gone to a huge floating array. What will be interesting is whether or not these will reduce evaporation - if it does expect nearly every inland body of water to end up with solar panels esp in arid “dry out in record time” Australia

 

Reality.