Why are blatantly racist threads allowed?

On the internet, we are all 1's and 0's... words converted into bits that travel through cyberspace. More about the messenger is only known when such is stated and believed, but more information is unnecessary. There is, in a sense, no "black" or "white". Only 0 or 1. Yet, the 0's and 1's are all mixed together, so we are more or less all a mulatto of 0's and 1's. One could ban the 0's so that there will only be 1's, but then the message would no longer be the same. Racism just does not work in cyberspace. Sure, one can talk bad about a group of people, without knowing that one is agreeing with them on certain issues. Your position is obsolete. It's no longer valid. Thousands of years ago, people didn't venture beyond the local hill, causing groups to be closely nit. Yet, these days, we travel beyond the hill without taking any steps, networking with everyone.

 

We have opinions expressed regularly on the forum which are, or might be, considered by others as being 'against' a wide variety groups (racial, political and other groups). We even also others asking for those views which appear (in their opinion) to be 'against', or even supportive of, all of those various groups to be removed or 'silenced', and the members posting them to be banned. We don't censor opinion like that here, nor are we ever going to - and as long as they are just expressions of opinion for discussion and debate, and comply with the forum rules, that is fine. People are allowed to discuss any opinion here, even if others do not like them, as long as they comply with the rules - the forum's Mission Statement is very explicit on that subject (added bold):

The forum rules exist to support the intentions of that Mission Statement, and the 'Flamebaiting' rule is quite clear about what is and isn't allowed when referring to any of those groups - expressions of opinion are allowed, simple abuse isn't.

If there appears to be a balance of opinions (and therefore threads and posts) on the forum at any particular time that seem to be on one 'side' or another, or aimed towards one 'group' or another, that is reflective of the membership and the number of members who hold those opinions at that time (and it certainly doesn't mean that those are the only opinions, or that those opinions are being expressed without being opposed by others, or even that it is always the same balance - that latter issue is a matter of wider political trends at any given time). We have no control over that, and it's not up to the moderators to prevent any opinion from being discussed, or to 'protect' any particular group from debate, or to make the number of threads equal between different topics, and certainly not to ban x amount of members so that the numerical balance between the various opinions are equal. We are only here to ensure that what is posted is opinion for discussion, not just nasty abuse.

If anybody wants the kind of forum where opinions that are contrary to their own, or that they do not like, or that they find personally (from their own political point of view) 'inflammatory' are automatically removed and deleted, or where members are banned for expressing opinions that some others find to be contraversial, this is not the place for them. There exist on the internet many forums which are run by and for particular political groups, according to their political agenda, where opposing voices are 'silenced' by deletions and bans. This is not one of those places. This is a forum which, as the Mission Statement clearly states, 'does not restrict the ability of users to express their political views, even if those views are inflammatory or unorthodox.'.

People are allowed to post their opinions here whether or not other members (or moderators) agree with those opinions, disagree with them, or find them to be 'inflammatory or unorthodox', as long as they do so in compliance with the forum's rules and the spirit of the forum's Mission Statement.

 

It certainly is just like in Der Sturmer and Storm Front who also claim to be promoting free speech.

 

Can we ban politics, too? So many offensive topics within that category, best to just ban them all rathering than weeding through all the crap just to find something that isn't going to make me cry a little.

 

Liberals have over used their favorite word so much, lobbing the "racist" slur at anyone who disagrees with them. Now its overuse is coming back to haunt them, because firing a charge of racism no longer ends all debate like it used to.

Looks like you guys will have to invent another commie "-ISM" word to replace the one that you diluted through abuse and overuse.


Any thoughts?






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Well. I suppose we could call you a nazi scumbag, but of course we'd never be so rude. Incidentally there are actually sane people here who have never even thought of being liberals, let alone two-headed reactionary republican nutters.

 

The Truth is that nobody plays the race card more than does the far right. Clarence Thomas - Herman Cain - Alan Keyes are examples. In fact, Keyes played it so much that he has virtually dropped out of the political scene. Ditto for JC Watts who was at one time the poster boy for Republicans who wanted to use him as their Black role model - then when it was discovered that he fathered a child out of wedlock they dropped him like a smelly diaper.

 

This is funny, since I'm still waiting for many on the far right to explain to me who I'm supposed to be racist against!

 

I have to admit this is the most fun I've had in my life watching politics and it's affect on race.

I think last 4 years has given us a lifetime of documented, YouTube and fist had evidence.

... and better yet ... you can search for yourselves on this Forum.

 

Viv , I said I pray for PF , that includes everyone , I added the PF Staff to my post . I also pray for those that take me to task .

and that includes the Joker ...

when have you ever seen me run away ? I may be absent for a day or three , but I always come back , and I always will .

 

John 3 :16 is the only key to salvation .

 

You can wait for eternity to be over before we ever get any form of logical reply from the forum right wingers.

 

Whether you like it or not but on this forum the accusations of racism are thrown virtually exclusively by the far left. Especially when Islam is criticized. Never mind that Islam is not a race, nor it's a sacred cow which can do no wrong and is above criticism. But the far left is desperately trying to stifle the debate. You can criticize anything and anyone but and any criticism of Islam is met with accusations of racism.

Oh and lest we forget that the overwhelming majority of anti-semitic remarks (often sounding like quotes from the Protocols) on this forum are also posted by Israel-hating far left, not far right.

 

The last paragrpah is an example of how the Right plays "the race card".

I don't object to it, per se. I object to its intellectual vacuity and lack of substance. The logic is this: premise 1: when liberals attack lsrael they are doing it because they hate Jews; premise 2: a liberal is attacking Israel; conclusion, liberals are racists. It's pathetic! It's clear to me that there are posters from "the Left" who are virulent anti-semites, and some are members of this board. I have battled with them; they don't like discussion, like the Right, they prefer abuse on the whole. But the majority of Israel's critics are not racist, even though it suits their dumber opponents to slander them as such to shut down the discussion. I am a critic of most countries in the world, including China, and none of this "criticism" makes me racist. If you criticize someone for racism you should say why and be prepared to argue that.

It is of course true that subliminal or unconscious racism can also play a part in anti-semitism. This is condemned as "pc claptrap" by the Right unless it involves Israel, when they want to send the entire Left on "anti-semitism awareness courses"! Challenging this unconscious racism takes a lot more than "playing the race card". In these cases this would be a useless tactic because you accuse someone of racism when they are fully unaware of it. But it depends how you do it. I personally belive that the xenophobic instinct is within all of us and that we should be able to discuss each other's racism without "playing any race card".

Nazis are one thing and deserve the appropriate derisory response, but Nelson Mandela is quite another. He described the racist impulse by describing when, after his release from prison he was travelling on a long haul flight. He was nervous. When the pilot came to greet him, his heart fell and his nervousness became stronger. The pilot was black. For the world's greatest anti-racist freedom fighter to describe how he himself had been conditioned to such a racist response was illuminating for me. We can be racist for the same reason we buy a certain brand of soap powder - because we have been conditioned to think like that.

 

...For you, not me...

Like I said, I used to be a Catholic until my priest removed from a weekend retreat (I had been on 5 retreats before this one, so I was a peer leader in the youth group) and see a pyschologist because a wrote a meditation on Hell and the dangers of living your life against God's laws. That pretty much discouraged me, and I quickly lost faith in that religion.

For several years, I've been studying Buddhism, and I'd like now to consider myself an agnostic Buddhist, though not a very good one. I just need to find a nice temple nearby to associate with and a good leader to guide me in my studies.

 

I have never heard that story before about the pilot.

Not that I could ever stand in question of Mandela, but I see that event differently. It was prejudicial thought, like an early warning system to actual racism.

 

All too often, PC robots blur the lines between realism and racism. It doesn`t take much effort to dream up a "racist" twist on any subject.

 

Well we can change the labels of what we call things. It doesn't change the substance of what I was saying, except perhaps in tuning down how offended people get by the word "racism". I don't know what Mandela called it, but it was clear that he was saying that there are "prejudicial thoughts" in all of us which if we don't work to control, can easily spin into racism.

 

Accusations of racism such as delusional claims about Affirmative Action, playing the race card, and others are made by the far right. Jew baiting and hate is exclusively right wing as well. As for Islam, while you people express hate for Muslims because of terrorism, you conveniently ignore the imperialism and crimes committed by Westerners on Muslims such as the invasions of North Africa and the Middle East. Millions died and all you do is to applaud.

 

Because the Internet is the last remaining refuse for Racist before their relevance fades into Diversity.

 

What are the delusional claims about Affirmative Action, made by the far right? Quotas, reverse discrimination?

 

Demographics!

 

Not the internet. Not all discussion boards allow these discussions as we come across here at PF.
According to the mission statement, all opinion are welcome. But lets not forget, this is an attempt "to bring opposites together to relate their views and learn from one another"..
Perhaps, instead of disregarding the opinions of those with racist views as nonsense, we should attempt to educate and gently persuade them to rethink.

 

Precisely. Either that or simply point out how wrong they are, and point out exactly why they are so wrong, using simple logic, evidence and basic common sense, expressed through the medium of 'vigorous respectful debate', and in full compliance with the rules - it really shouldn't be that hard to do!

People are perfectly free to express any opinion they like, as long as they do so within the forum rules. Other people are perfectly free to challenge those stated opinions, as long as they do so within the forum rules.

There are other places on the internet run by and for people who hold extreme and bigotted views, where they gather together to discuss them, pat each other on the back about how clever and superior they and their kind are, and where dissenting voices are quickly banished for daring to suggest that they may not actually be such a wonderously higher 'master race' after all. This is certainly not one of those places! This is a place where any views can be expressed as long as the posts abide by the rules, but where anyone expressing such extreme views will quickly find that there are plenty of good posters perfectly willing and able to directly and effectively challenge their stated 'ideology' in debate - as long as they also abide by the forum rules, that's fine - hopefully at least some of them will indeed learn from it.

 

I detect resistance on the part of some here to take that step you are talking about - to go through the effort to prove people like me "wrong". Most of the time they just shower a debate with allegations of "bigotry" and "racism" in an attempt to discredit an opposing opinion, without presenting any real facts or evidence.

Take, for example, the Israel-Palestine debate, or the white-black IQ gap, or the disparity in development between white and non-white peoples around the world. Most on the hard left feel that any white-brown disparity in income or ability is the result of "white racism".

Now, I do not claim to be "superior" to anyone else - Africans, Amerindians, Aboriginals are certainly more equipped for survival in their own natural environments. Natural genetic resistance to high altitude sickness (the Inca), or resistance to tropical diseases (blacks), or even high fertility (Amerindians) are all survival traits. European and North Asian survival traits have all revolved around scientific advancement (and thus cerebral growth) instead of physical adaptations. Why are 90% of the pilots for South African Airlines still white, even after 20 years of intense racial quotas attempting to reverse that number? (the remaining 10% are mostly Indian or Colored) There are glaring facts regarding race and ability that simply cannot be explained away by do-gooder liberals.



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