12-Year-Old Boy Dies After Police in Cleveland Shoot Him

Its not up to me to prove the cop is lying, its up to the cop to prove he killed in self-defense or to protect imminent harm to the life of another. There are too many cases in which a cop kills, automatically claims he thought his life was in danger (the "officer safety" trump card), and gets away with it whether he was in danger or not.

I said "apparently" because the video has not been released, but I just read that the cops claim the family of the victim has seen the video, but the family has not said anything about it. Maybe there is video, maybe its conclusive video, but until either the family talks about it or I see it, I don't believe the cops.

 

You conveniently leave out some very important facts.

1 - open carry is legal in that part of Ohio, it does NOT matter one tiny bit that the gun looked real or was real, Crawford was not breaking the law
2 - Crawford was holding the gun in one hand, the gun was pointing at the ground, and he did not point it at the cops
3 - Crawford was on the phone, a cop said "put it down", Crawford immediately said "its not real", and was immediately murdered. Crawford was surprised and was not given any time to comply with the command.
4 - Special Prosecutor Piepmeier, who investigated the killing, said Crawford did nothing wrong and did not break the law. Piepmeier still let the killer cop go free.

A guy who was not breaking any law, was not threatening anyone, is suddenly accosted by cops and immediately killed. Sound fair?

There is a mitigating factor - but it does not excuse the cops murderous action. The single 911 caller - Ronald Ritchie - lied to the 911 operator, he said Crawford was pointing the gun at people and threatening people. The video clearly shows that was a lie.

So the 911 caller put the cops in their murderer mentallity. Hopefully Ritchie will be punished for essentially "SWATing" Crawford.

Bur Special Prosecutor Piepmeier said Ritchie was a concerned citizen just doing the right thing. I'm not holding my breath that justice will prevail.

 

Read my reply (post 277) to your earlier comment about Crawford.

I've seen the pictures and the surveillance video, and the various articles and comments. Crawford was murdered, even Special Prosecutor Piepmeier said Crawford did nothing wrong.

Maybe you have no clue, or are blinded to the truth. Maybe, assuming you are in EMS, its too disturbing to think that the people you are around all day can at the flip of a switch turn into murderers.

 

Perfect representation of our police. M4 Carbines needed to subdue a camper with a pocket knife? The "get home" priority is destroying this country.

You signed up. Sorry you were too much of a f*cking coward to go join the military. This ain't a battlefield.

We see it, day in, day out. People gunned down by delta force wannabes with axes to grind.

As for the OP, there is no requirement to keep the orange tip, and if there was, it would be unhelpful, since criminals would likely paint the tips orange.

After seeing the above, I'd like an explanation from anyone who condones this behavior. Seriously. What's your explanation? Why shoot a man 3 times in the back, sick a dog on him, and shoot bean bags at him. The man was clearly seriously wounded. Obviously your f*cking bean bags won't have any effect. Ever think, you nazi gestapo murdering son of a (*)(*)(*)(*)(*), that you should have tried the bean bags and dog FIRST?

Defending this behavior makes you JUST as culpable as the sleazy immune scumbag murdering bastard cops.

 

What I'm trying to say is, if the cop knew he'd be in real trouble for shooting someone important, he'd for sure have found a non-fatal way to handle the situation. Shooting should be a last resort in ALL situations.

 

We know the police don't discriminate. As the Mayor of a town in MD. His dogs were executed during a no-knock raid.

I do. But what I believe is irrelavent.

No, I don't think they are, not anymore. When police are trained to veiw every fish in the tank as a shark, they no longer have the credibility or the moral standing to avoid this criticism. Secondly, if they are trained that way, then we need to untrain them or remove them, and alter that training for new civil servants.

If we aren't guaranteed police protection by the constitution (we aren't) then why do we have them at all?

 

I speculate that a good deal of the problem here lies neither with all the unarmed black kids being gunned down by white cops, nor with inappropriate police training that encourages them to shoot too hastily. Instead, what we have here is an interaction. The police are accustomed to a sort of exaggerated deference from most people (yes sir! No sir! Whatever you say, sir!) and come to expect it. And we have young black males who have no respect for the police (perhaps for good reason - even distinguished black professors get stopped and questioned regularly, an experience normal white people never have). And these people don't bother to pretend respect or deference, they instead react to the police with belligerant hostility. They are confrontational. The police sometimes overreact to this.

And yes, there is racism here. Not the blatant KKK sort, but a more subtle set of stereotypes operating. We "know" that blacks aren't too bright, that they are disprespectful, that they commit far more than their share of the crimes, that they are often armed and often violent and unpredictable - even their children. They are all on welfare, and are a pure burden on society.

As L.Z. Granderson wrote, the first time a cop pulled out a gun and pointed it at him was when he was 12 years old, carrying a gallon of milk home from the store. The cop said he "looked like someone else." And, says Granderson, "I've looked like that person ever since."

 

The cops were called with a report of a kid with a gun.

The cops confronted the kid and told him to put his hands up. Instead the kid reached for the gun.

The cop shot fearing the kid was going to pull a gun on him. That's justified.

But blame the cop and ask nothing about he kid or the parents who let a twelve year old have a toy made to look like a gun and run around unsupervised with it. Because personal responsibility isn't a thing.

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A last resort like when someone pulls a gun on you? Like the officer believe the boy was doing?

 

So a cop can't shoot someone pulling s gun on them?

We shouldn't have police? We should just let people do whatever they like. You've clearly abandoned personal responsibility. Where were the parents? Why was a twelve year old alone? Why did he had the toy modeled to look like a real gun? Why did he had the freedom to remove he Orange safety cap? These are all questions that need to be answered but no one seems to care. They just want it to be a race issue. Guess that's more convinient for them.

 

The cops drove up and killed him within 2 seconds of getting out of their car.
Of course, this will be touted by the racists as just another thug getting his just desserts.

 

The video is out. The cops pulled up and immediately shot the kid - opened the car door, as soon as he was clear enough to draw and kill he did. The kid had no chance to do anything, even if the killer cop was yelling for the kid to get down or put his hands up he didn't give the kid a chance to comply.

 

I had a .22 rifle when I was 12.

 

You'd rather spit on the grave of a policeman, who has a wife and a family to support?

 

As they say, Pictures are a thousand words(And Video's 1001 ). I happened to turn on MSNBC(one of the few times I've done so since Chris Matthews called me a racist lol), glad I did. The whole situation was awful:

-Dispatcher gets fired, it's his or her job to relay the situation to PO's as accurately as possible, so that they can properly respond to situations. That didn't happen as the dispatcher failed MISERABLY to relay the known facts: A Juvie with a fake gun. The transcript also shows he/she either couldn't hear at one point, OR wasn't listening. I'm curious about video of the dispatch room. WTF was that dispatcher doing at the time?

-This correlates to what happened next, but it's still mind-boggling. Because either the officers were blind as hell, or deliberately covered their asses on radio feed.
They were less than 2 FT away from the kid, they could've easily restrained him, used a taser. ANYTHING. But no, the slimy cowards got out, hid behind their car and took all of ONE minute(at best) before summarily executing him.

What caps it off? "About 20" ARE YOU KIDDING ME? When I was 12, I was 4'11. I'm a 22 yr old 6'0 male. So unless the kid has magic beans(or tall genes) I don't know where they got that.

Except, they ran on adrenaline, killed the kid and when they realized it went into defensive(lying) mode. Thank GOD there's video in this case, further strengthening the need to police THE police. Because somewhere in their "training manuals", "innocent UNTIL PROVEN guilty is not computing on a NATL. Level.

Overall, sad for everyone involved. The family, the kid and even the caller's probably traumatized. "Should I make that call again?" The caller probably feels unneeded guilt about this case. Don't. It's not your fault. These murderers should not be getting paid, but removed from the police and charged with Third-Degree Murder.

 

That is not what I saw in the video, it looked like the kid was hit and flat on the ground before they got behind the car. That goes to the possibility they believed he was still a threat after he went down.

 

The video was a bit grainy, but that makes it worse. That shows a complete lack of situational awareness. Further proof they should never serve on the line of duty again.

 

So they paid off the witnesses and forensic people...gothca.

When you have evidence instead of prejudiced suppositions let me know.

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So you are only left with bromides and platitudes......gothca.

 

Her it folks, the lack of rebuttal and ad hominem. Typical when the emotional nonsense runs out.

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You don't have enough sense to figure that out yourself?

 

And it has to be shown it was a reasonable belief and the forensic evidence has to support it.

For example, this man was killed when he was clearly not a threat, the cop that shot him 3 times (in the back) was exonerrated, the APD decided it was a justifed shooting, video of the shooting here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwytoxMuk4U[/QUOTE]

"During the hours-long standoff with police, Boyd, the "illegal camper" continued to threaten officers with death. Police also discovered that Boyd had a violent 20-year criminal history that included multiple incidents of violence against officers. Boyd’s history also showed years of mental health related concerns.
Video shows when officers moved in on Boyd around 7:30 p.m on the night of the shooting. At the beginning of incident, Boyd can be heard saying, “In a private world, if you were down at a bar or a bus stop, I would have the right to kill you right now because you’re trying to take me over. Don’t get stupid with me!” Boyd collects not one, but TWO knives from his belongings and refuses to disarm himself. This is a justified shooting and not just by my opinion, but that of the TEAM of investigators that reviewed the case. Unfortunate, yes. Justified, absolutely."

 

In our country the police are a greater danger to the public than are criminals. The trauma from police assault can be worse than from assault by criminals. The public thinks the police are there to protect them. But that's not true.

 

In self defense the prosecution has to prove otherwise. You have been reported to the police that you are The police are yelling at you three times to put your hands up, there is a weapon tucked in your waist band, you reach for, your dead.

 

It's stop motion not real time. Rice was approaching him and refusing to put his arms up.

 

Can a two year even hold a gun and pull a trigger?

I don't think a police officer would fear his life if it were a two year old, as the two year old doesn't know any better.

But a twelve year old has had time to learn, time to be taught that you don't point guns, even toy guns, at police officers, and that you do what the police officer tells you to.

As far as exemptions, I don't see how gender or skin color would matter in this situation.

 

And the video:

[video=youtube;gP8DNB4Fbs4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP8DNB4Fbs4[/video]

 

The video is in near real-time. It's hard to tell because for some reason, the time stamp isn't present. Dumbass cops pull right up next to the pavilion, one of them gets out of the car something like 3 feet from the 12 year old kid, and starts shooting. Is this really what these cops were trained to do? They failed to give themselves enough time and distance to properly react and control the situation. Their incompetence and that cop's freaking out resulted in the death of a 12 year old kid who was playing.

Yet some people will defend them no matter how ridiculous and incompetent their actions are.