Who should be penalised for the mother's poor choices?

In the event of an unwanted pregnancy, who should be punished? The mother or the baby?
That is, should this little innocent human life get the death penalty through no fault of its own?
Why should the baby be punished for the sins of the mother?


"I've got two daughters— nine years old and six years old... if they make a mistake... I don't want them punished with a baby."
— Barack Obama


[video=youtube;HB5Frgw0Fww]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB5Frgw0Fww[/video]

 

This is a false dichotomy. We dont need to punish anyone. We can kill the fetus while it does not yet have a mind. This solves the issue, while not punishing or harming any sentient beings.

 

That argument may hold for a zygote, but what about at 23-26 weeks, when the brain has already undergone much development?
This premature babies being born at 26 weeks and surviving is not that uncommon. Are you saying it would be okay to commit infanticide on this baby after it had already left the womb, just because its brain has not developed to your standards?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWw7ghGHKi8

 

but I don’t consider the fetus to be a who yet so what’s the problem?

 

Well why would that be wrong? Is the baby or fetus more developed then cow or chicken when it comes to its thoughts at that point?

 

No, I dont support abortion after 20 weeks, when the mind has most probably developed. But there is nothing wrong with for example first trimester abortion.

 

What sin did the mother commit?

 

1. selfishness without regard for another human being
2. irresponsibility
3. fornication
4. murder
5. arguably sloth and laziness for not wanting to go through with the pregnancy (she can just adopt you you know)

These are just a few I can think of off the top of my head; I'm sure there's more.

 

Something like a baby growing inside the mother seems so intimate and personal, I don't see how you or anyone else has the right to impede. It would be like me coming in your house, in your shower, and telling your wife to give her chest another scrub or two, dirty woman.

 

Jeeze, it's a good thing we all have the right to NOT believe in religious BS!

 

I'm also wondering, since abortion seems to be against republicans code, if there happen to be no republicans ever who have gotten or asked anothr to get an abortion? Is it only democrats and "libs" that are doing this?

 

I'm sure some hypocrisy exists, just like it exists on both sides. Politicians that support gun control yet use a gun to shoot a home intruder, for example.

 

Do you have a viable alternative for women who find themselves abandoned by all supports?

 

Gee when did that actually happen - EVER?

 

No one knows what his decision would be until he is faced with it.

http://mypage.direct.ca/w/writer/anti-tales.html

Although few studies have been made of this phenomenon, a study done in 1981 (1) found that 24% of women who had abortions considered the procedure morally wrong, and 7% of women who'd had abortions disagreed with the statement, "Any woman who wants an abortion should be permitted to obtain it legally." A 1994/95 survey (2,3) of nearly 10,000 abortion patients showed 18% of women having abortions are born-again or Evangelical Christians. Many of these women are likely anti-choice. The survey also showed that Catholic women have an abortion rate 29% higher than Protestant women. A Planned Parenthood handbook on abortion notes that nearly half of all abortions are for women who describe themselves as born-again Christian, Evangelical Christian, or Catholic. (4)

According to a 1987 article, Abortion Clinics' Toughest Cases,(5) "Physicians and clinics frequently terminate pregnancies for women who believe abortion is 'murder' and 'a sin' but who are not anti-abortion activists. Demonstrators, organizers, and leaders in the [anti-abortion] movement are seen less frequently, ranging from perhaps once or twice a month to a few times in the course of a professional career."

 

So you want to force woman to give birth against their will?

 

I want to force women who (1) chose to engage in sexual intercourse, (2) did not use a condom and another form of contraceptive measure, and then, on top of all that, (3) allowed their baby to continue developing even after they could have terminated the very undeveloped fetus, to give give birth against their will. There's a difference.

 

Perhaps Iran would better suit your anti-freedom stance.

 

Liberals have already done this to everyone else with their "low-flow" showerhead mandate.

Are you saying that a woman has a right to brutally destroy her own little hapless developing child, but I do not have the simple right to buy whatever type of light bulb I want?

 

Says it all really...............

PS - there is still a high failure rate with condoms - and it is the MAN'S fault but you still "want to force women"........

 

I have personal moral issues with termination of a pregnancy in the later stages. Simply because at this point .. whatever we call the lifeform .. it pretty much meets all the criteria for what I would classify as "a living human".

The issue at this point is still best left to the mother. If the stage is late enough I think attempts to try and save the baby should be made.

 

See below.

If it is the mothers choice to do so, yes.

Getting pregnant isnt a sin mate. Get over your ancient misogyny. As for 'punishing babies', abortion isnt punishment - its simple death, for which they have no interest or care and this in turn provides justification for such action.

Obama is right.

 

Usually they are - even in Maternal crisis because these are WANTED babies. Late term pregnancy (third trimester) overwhelming occurs because the foetus is incompatible with life

 

Agreed .. It is my understanding as well that this procedure.. for reasons other than that given above .. are exceedingly rare.

The lifers bring this up only to divert attention away from the fact that they can not substantiate the "its a human at conception" sillyness.

 

If it's wrong, why should the decission still be left up to the mother? We don't allow women to choose whether they want to abuse their little infants.
The fact that the unborn baby is inside the mother certainly is one factor to consider, but that factor by itself by no means should give women the right to do whatever they want to their baby.

That does not mean that late-term abortions done on healthy babies with healthy mothers are not still being done.

I don't have any problem with abortions on severely deformed/retarded babies: I see it as a mercy killing.
But in the Unites States alone, 18000 perfectly normal healthy late-term babies are aborted every year, and it has nothing to do with the woman's physical health.