Who should be penalised for the mother's poor choices?

I child with a severe deformity is a very different thing than a child in an unhappy foster home.

 

lol... so because girls cut themselves you believe all children should be aborted? and are you a magician or something? how are you going to determine which 1 out of 5 girls are going to be cutting themselves?

cutting yourself /=/ wanting death

 

Are they? Both are unhappy with their lives.

 

Please tell me when I said every girl should be aborted. Can't find it? because I didn't say it. I say it's the mothers choice. And, if the person is being born into an unfit environment, that is a pretty good reason to abort.

 

Really? And what if they can't?

What if they are prisoner of a non-functioning body that should never have been?

Do you feel that feed lots are human? Do you think that it is alright, for example, to keep young calfs prisoners their all short life in tiny little box, so small that they can never even take two steps, and feed them until they are ready to be "harvested" for their meat?

Do you think that it is more human to produce those baby calfs and keep them in those boxes their whole life, rather than prevent their existence?

Have you ever seen a young person, totally disabled, unable to think, to hear, to speak, but moaning in a nursing home bed, hidden in a "private room," alone, day and night, with for only "human touch" the cold hands of an orderly changing his soiled diapers and inserting a new needle in his arm to "keep him nourished?"

I have.

 

pro murderers and their obsession with religion. this has nothing to do with religion. forcing someone to be your slave and killing an innocent out of convenience are both evil acts PERIOD.

how are they similar? end result is the victim has no control of their own fate.

 

yet there is no clear definition of a fit environment as i clearly proved earlier. its in the eyes of the beholder.

 

No, there are standards for living environments. Those houses you see in Hoarders? Unfit for living.

 

Saying they are evil is religious. Is killing an ant or a squirrel evil? Is killing a creature that cannot think or feel more evil than killing something that can think and feel?

Saying a mass of flesh is a victim is an overstatement..

 

yet the people living in those houses love it. its in the eyes of the beholder

 

Many have mental illnesses. Others don't like it, but are just too lazy to pick it up.

 

and thats why this ties into slavery/racism. discrimination on someone based off of a characteristic. in this case discrimination against people who are under a certain stage of development.

 

And your point is?

We already have established that THE LAW doesn't allow late term abortion without a valid reason. . .and that, although that acceptable "reason" can vary from state to state, it is AT THE LEAST a serious physical or psychological danger for the woman, and/or a significant malformation or disability of the fetus.

I assume that now you are going to tell me that "sometimes" those strict laws are not observed and that some late term abortions occur that are not legal?

Well. . .probably, yes. And what do you want to do about that?

Those are NOT LEGAL. . .just as it is NOT LEGAL to abuse a child, or to shoot a teenager, or to run over someone with your car. . . .and there are MEANS for the law to punish the people involved in those ILLEGAL acts.

What does that have to do with LEGAL abortions, be it early term or the most stringent laws of late term abortions?

If someone engage in an ILLEGAL action like infanticide. . . why do you think that making all abortions, or even all late term abortions illegal would change the fact that there will ALWAYS be some people who DO NOT FOLLOW THE LAW?

Face it. There is NO ONE in the pro-choice movement who applauds ILLEGAL abortions. In fact, I have never met a "pro-choice" person who applauds ANY abortion, but they do understand that, WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE LAW, it is the CHOICE OF THE WOMAN, and NO ONE ELSE.

 

That stage being NOT YET BORN. Not being able to think or feel.

 

clearly you havent met many fellow pro choicers

 

continued discrimination.

 

Have you?

 

The only way the slavery/abortion analogy works is by comparing the woman to the slave. She is the one who carries and labors for the fetus throughout the pregnancy and at birth. If she cannot abort, it is because the fetus owns her (uterus). Who DOES the uterus belong to, the woman or the fetus?

 

yes i have

 

Discrimination against a mass of flesh without feeling or thoughts? What next, blaming me for discriminating over which color of butterfly I like the best?

 

thats like saying parents are slaves to their kids and it should be legal for parents to kill their dependents

 

And how many have said they applaud any abortion? I don't and it seems everyone debating with you doesn't.

 

Once again, we disagree! There are VERY STRICT standards for a "fit environment." In fact, there are huge books of "regulations" that describe in details what kind of "environment" is acceptable to provide housing, food, and entertainment for ANY person who can't make their own decisions. . .from children in foster care, to schools, to group homes for the disabled.

And. . .by the way. . .that is part of the "social welfare" that you guys so resent to have to pay taxes for! And these people are part of the 47% Romney has such disregard for!

Again. . .I know. I supervised and assured the compliance of several group homes (and state hospital) to those rules. . .in an ATTEMPT to assure that my disabled clients led as safe and as happy a life as possible. . .and let me tell you. .. happiness is a strange word as it relates to that population!

 

You're contradicting yourself and it isn't like that at all. I'm saying if your slavery analogy works at all, it is the woman as slave. Answer the question. Who owns the uterus?

 

also...stop trying to flip flop this around. the slave owner is the woman..... more powerful, in control, more organized. believing that they control the other party and that any attempt to defend the people they are oppressing is an attack on them. both the woman and the slave owner are committing acts on others that they would never want to have done on themselves. while the slaves are the babies. weak, cant stand up for themselves, have no choice.